Hold your horses grown-ups. Before you get too excited, this one is for the groms.
PRESS RELEASE: ChromagIt appears everyone and their dog already knows about this, but here's the full scoop.
We design stuff that we want to use. That's how every Chromag product has come into existence, and as some of us are parents, the Minor Threat is no exception.
The keener eyes amongst you might have noticed this bike is a full suspension, also fondly referred to as a twin squisher or double boing-boing. You might also be surprised that our first foray into this domain was with a kid's bike.
The truth is, even though this is a kid's bike, it's a technical engineering exercise with many of the same hurdles as that of an adults' bike (if not more, the cost constraints on a kid's bike are considerably tighter). Nonetheless, we have a whole host of talented people here at Chromag that were eager to push their skills into the full suspension dimension (someone please use this as their band name).
We were also just really excited to design a (frankly) f**kin' awesome kid's bike, especially as almost all of us grew up riding klunkers that were nowhere near as good. I think my first "mountain" bike was a Raleigh Nexos, and even your most
underbiked gravel rider would pass that up in this day and age. That didn't stop me shralping that thing through the local woods though, and chasing that feeling of freedom is what the Minor Threat is all about.
Kids are growing up with 12 speed clutch drive-trains and will never know the pain of running an over-engineered chain guide that is as good at keeping your chain off, as it is on. Don't get me wrong, this isn't a bad thing, think of what these kids will be capable of in 10 years time. Hell, look at what they're capable of now. I'm not too proud to say these groms might actually require better gear than we had
back-in-the-day.
With that in mind, we set about designing it for them.
The Minor Threat has a 4-bar linkage driving 140mm of rear wheel travel tuned for the lighter rider. The S1 size sports 24" wheels and a 140mm Revelation up front. The S2 has 26" wheels and a 150mm Pike.
The progression of the Minor Threat is 18%, which is relatively low when compared to an adults bike. The reason being is to ensure the entire range of travel can be utilised by a lighter rider. However the average leverage ratio is higher than that of an adults bike to help with suspension setup at low air pressures. The rear axle path is typical of that of a 4 bar linkage. It moves rearward in the first 50mm of travel and returns gradually up to its 140mm limit.
Time to put the kettle on, there's a bunch of graphs coming up...
Ok now you've skipped over those, let's talk geo. The Minor Threat has a 64° head tube angle and a 76° seat tube angle, which can be steepened by 1° with the installed flip chip, depending on what floats your boat. The S1 has a reach of 360mm and the S2 has 400mm, both of which can be increased by 10mm in the steep position. They both have ample room to install a dropper post, and come with QR seat clamps.
We're also rather proud of the build kit as it's no different to what you'd find on most of our own bikes. SRAM Eagle drivetrains, G2 brakes, Rockshox suspension and Maxxis Minion tyres are a few highlights, not to mention we've obviously decked it out in Chromag parts including the all new, kids specific Vanguard 720mm bar. The purple anodised hubs on the Black Candy option are another highlight, not even the adults can get hold of these.
The frame is made from double butted 6066 aluminum tubing (roughly translates to
aluminium for those across the pond), with billet machined aluminum linkage plates and junctions.
Hang on, aluminum?? We know, steel forever right. Well... not quite. Material selection is a huge part of the design process. We make bikes from titanium, pedals from plastic and bars from 7000 series aluminum (We did actually play around with a steel bar/stem combo at one point). For this bike, aluminum made the most sense for a number of reasons, which we'll go into below this lovely photo of a CNC spindle covered in milk.
Firstly, the use of aluminum allows us to make a bike that’s burly enough to hold up to the bike park without being too heavy for a lighter rider to manage. Aluminum has a lower strength-to-weight ratio than steel, meaning that more volume of aluminum is required to make a frame that holds up to our strength standards. This is why you’ll notice that the tubing used in the construction of the Minor Threat is thicker than that used on our steel frames.
A big one, especially for a kid's bike, is that aluminum is pretty low-maintenance. As you probably know all too well if you own one of our steel frames, it’s very important to grease your seatpost every couple of months (reminder: go and do that now!). If water gets into an ungreased steel seat tube, it will corrode the steel and form a bond with the aluminum of your seatpost, making it nearly impossible to remove. However, this isn’t an issue with an aluminum bike. While unpainted steel is not naturally corrosion-resistant, aluminum is. Long story short, it’s a little more forgiving to being “ridden hard and put away wet”.
Just like the rest of our Taiwanese-made frames like the Rootdown, Stylus, and Monk, the Minor Threat is handmade by a team of highly skilled framebuilders in Taiwan, and is held to the same stringent quality control standards that we're known for.
S1 and S2, why two sizes? Why not just allow for a wheel swap? In reality you can run both 24" and 26" wheels on both frame sizes, we just don't recommend it. Increasing the wheel size, doesn't increase the size of the bike, it just lifts it farther from the ground. It does nothing to affect geometry like rear-center, reach & wheelbase, or account for head tube and seat tube angles. Just like we do with our adult bikes, we dove deep into the sizing of the Minor Threat, and in the end the S1 and S2 sizes made the most sense to us.
We place a high value on being able to service bikes and parts as much as possible to keep them in fine fettle. We treated the Minor Threat in the same way, with full disclosure on technical drawings and a wide range of service kits available so these bikes last a long time. Even when your wee nipper does eventually out grow it, you'll be able to re-sell, or pass it down to the next one in good confidence.
As you can see, no small amount of thought and effort has gone into designing the Minor Threat. We're really excited about being a part of the next generation of rippers and helping the youngsters get off to as good a start as they possibly can.
There you have it, a Chromag full suspension bike. As a kid's bike, perhaps it's not quite what you were expecting, but we'll leave you with this: if you see one mouse in the kitchen, there's a good chance
more mice are close-at-hand.
A limited run of the Minor Threat is available for pre-order now at
chromagbikes.com, and soon at select bike shops in North America. It retails for $3950 CAD in both S1 and S2 sizes, and is only available as a complete bike.
Thanks for reading!
- The Chromag Crew xChromag bikes, parts, apparel and accessories are
available online and at
quality bike shops.
You know, the important stuff.
Would have liked to have supported local. Looking forward to the 26"
Just don't buy the bike.
"they come out with an aluminum full sus? Most kids don’t need that."
You've not been to Whistler have you?
Not really true - full suspension makes it much easier for kids to ride proper trails - on smaller wheels a hard tail is really hard work on anything other than smooth blues.
JP
1. We need to change our mindset about kids bikes, why should they be cheaper than our bike, the cost of the materials is only slightly less. Would you ride a 350.00 walmart bike down blue or black trail, why do you expect your kid to. Back in the day most kids just rode with other kids, that's how i grew up. Now we ride with our kids.
2. Many countries dont have a separate standard for kids/adult bikes. so kids bikes have to be designed to pass the same weight limits etc...so dont expect a kids bike to be a flyweight. We purchased our kids latest from Germany and it came with a 80 pound weight limit. And guess what, the burley tire build with dropper is only 25 pounds.
@blackthorne: “Profiteering - the practice of making or seeking to make an excessive or unfair profit, especially illegally or in a black market.“
$3k is in line with most base model adult full-suss bikes and this one required special R&D. Plus, it includes decent parts and is a limited run. The market will decide if the price is excessive.
Besides, profits are a good thing—I hope they make a lot.
He is now on a Full Sus 24" so lets see how that progresses.
I get resale will help ease the pain, but I pity the parents of little shredders right now.
Have been to Whistler. Blown away this isn’t a dual-crown, 8 piston brakes, and 20mm rear axle bike. Because, all the young people there seem to be absolute
shredders.
One can absolutely rip black and blue trails on sub $3,000 bikes.
There are bunch of sub $3,000 bikes that are not Walmart bikes that are more than capable of shredding black and blue trails. i.e Growler, Fuse, Honzo etc.
Personally I will invest extra money in coaching for my kid than as opposed to over biking him/her.
Agree that FS not always the answer, since kid / bike weight ration kinda imbalanced.
Profiteering aka Business
Chromag is in the business of making bicycles, selling them at a profit so that they canake more bicycles.
If you don't like that, you should try socialism.
So you got a comment instead.
However, zero children = end of humanity, so the answer is somewhere in between.
How about aim for a stabile population. That should be focused on.
You are kidding yourself if you think that the current world population growth is sustainable. That growth is the single largest threat to mother earth(that and nuclear war).
That old anti-people/overpopulation/earth-worshipping B.S. is highly debated at most and just wrong otherwise. Population is stabilizing and will eventually start declining in the not-too-distant future.
You say kids “are stupid” but I find they can really help people stave off becoming empty, self-important, self-absorbed, finger-waggers who preach their dangerous (China one child policy), doomsday religion (you said “Amen”).
My only regret about having just three kids is we couldn’t have more. They’re worth far more than their supposed ‘carbon footprint’ and certainly worth a nice bike, which is certainly not “stupid.”
#kidsareawesome
#havemorekids
I could see Dischord being cool with it.
Now, if Chromag had used Cro-Mag, I could see Harley or John getting upset....but who knows if either of them even has a copyright anymore....
GG Allin wrote 'Legalise Murder' but we don't attribute homocide crime figures to him because of it.
Missing a lot if you write off Minor Threat so easily.
I mean....he deserves a bike named in his honor too!
-150 respect Chromag
I think this backlash would have been inevitable given the state of punk and rock at the time. I'm not at all straight edge but I can see the cultural value in the both the song and the movement.
I think it is a big deal that significant cultural references are co-opted by companies for profit. Adam Yauch had the right idea in that sense. Hopefully Ian MacKaye just doesn't give a shit or at least gets free bikes his kids.
Ian went pretty vocal over NIKE's "Major Threat" campaign some years ago cause you know, NIKE, and at least the ad-campaign was suspended 'cause NIKE smelled the shitstorm coming, not because they feared a lawsuit.
I really doubt Ian, Jeff or anyone would have anything against Chromag's bike.
it's still a great song and I doubt Ian ever intended anyone to get stabbed over it. The band wrote other stuff and it didn't all contain SE references.
I'm not arguing the legal technicalities of using the name as I'm hopelessly ill informed about copyright etc, perhaps this is an example of borrowing from something admirable and that's all. I guess I feel a bit precious about one of the cornerstones of DIY punk/hardcore ethos being used to sell quite a pricey child's bike.
It does look like a decent bike though.
I really admire how Dischord (and Epitaph) got started and used their profits to promote new bands. That whole model perpetuated new generations of great artists and bands and they still have a similar attitude to the business of producing music.
Maybe this is a fitting homage, Chromag are a small bike brand, hopefully this bike will inspire a whole new generation of riders... maybe they can use the same profit model as Dischord... lol.
"Urban Outfitters was selling Minor Threat T-shirts. They called to see if this was true and I said, ‘Yeah.’ Another company makes them, and I just don’t give a f*ck."
I will take my precious punk gatekeeping and tidy it away
the kid is still getting used to it but I will likely convert to tubeless asap. which may save another 1/4 pound from the wheels.
A boy in his Zep group had a VPace last year. Super nice bike.
My kid is just a tad over 20 kilos so the lighter Vpace with much lower stand over was the way to go. The Fluid is a great whistler bike but a bit heavy for climbing(4 pounds heavier than the VPace.)
For kids weight is what kills the experience. Same for adults to a certain extent, but if you only weigh 25-30kg then a bike that's half your weight is just silly.
1. Wheelset - Stan's crest rims with Bitex hubs -700gm
2. Tubeless+DHF/DHR tyres (we had Veetyre stock) -400gm. Lighter Recon will save another 200gm if big knobs are not required yet.
3. Cranks+BB - 135mm cranks and BB from VPace.de -380gm
4. Brakes – swapped basic tektro to deore -100gm, rotors – swapped to Ashima -100gm (7y.o. can use single finger)
5. Derailleur – XT instead of deore – 50gm (smashed original deore)
6. Seat – swapped to small ec90 padded carbon (Aliexpress) -150gm
7. Handlebar – oclv carbon (Aliexpress) -140gm
8. Grips - Controltech Testy Lock-On Grips – no weight saving, but these are the thinnest lock-ons.
9. Pedals – Vpace.de -80gm
10. Fork upgrade (to Expert Air) -60gm.
Over 2kg saved. Big difference for a 20-35kg person. Total budget close to Fluid FS 1 24 with better components and fit all around and 2kg lighter. Amazing bike, real enabler.
1- The rear-end is too long. It dumb for kids to have unbalanced bikes with long stays. It has a big impact on them riding dynamically, manualing, bunny hoping, jumping, pumping etc. We've seen plenty of bikes with long rear ends like this (giants old rigids, Spesh Riprock, etc). It has a serious impact and these are just too long and unbalanced.
2- HUGE miss in not going with the full Manitou/Hayes/Sunringle/Protaper JUnit line. They made a line of highend kid specific components that the best groms in the world are rocking...and Chromag goes with adult stuff??? Wth?
3- 27.5" Adult fork is dumb on a 24" kids bike. These 140mm forks already create a lot of too high stack...imagine a 27.5. Even more for 3400$. WAY more so when a JUnit fork is there for the taking and is built with their highend dual chamber air spring (critical for low PSI kids), custom kid tune, a nice damper in a compact light-ish build. Huge fail not spec'ing this at least.
4- The cranks are way too long for kids on a 24" bike. We've tested out 155mm cranks, way to long. 140mm is ideal and what most proper kids brands have gone too. I think these NX cranks are a whopping 165mm lol. If the spec is right and they are X1 cranks, we have these too...and they are too long at 155mm for sure. The kids knees came up above his seat.
5- The NX drive trains suck because the cassette is an unsprung (important weight) boat anchor and the hub standard can be limiting. A GX (maybe it has this and is typo?) with XD hub drive is what I'd want or a nice/decent 11sp Deore. I'm not sure 50t plate and long derailleur work well for groms anyways. Our 11sp 10-42 gets plenty of abuse...I can only imagine that GX eagle inches away from doom every ride. Groms thrash bikes in unimaginable ways.
6- Rockshox Shock tunes for kids bikes that I've seen don't work. Sure the leverage ratio for impact can work...but the rebound at super low PSI's (to get proper sag) makes things like maple syrup. I haven't messed with this personally but who knows...still I'd want something that's damn near ideal for this money.
7- 3400$ and no freaking dropper post?? Lame. Also, its a pain in the ass getting droppers for kids that actually work. Parents struggle to know which ones would even work for their weight. A KS Lev Integra is as good as it gets (ultra smooth at low weights...even for 50lb 6yro) or KS Lev Si.
8- Adult bars aren't great for kids. Hand pain and fatigue are real for groms doing big DH rides. With Protapers JUnit bars (multiple sized grips for different hand sizes) or SDG's nice bars/grips that are proper kid widths...its silly to skip over and just go with adult bars. They'll work fine, but its old school tech. For the price I'd want stuff that fit my kid since there are multiple component manufacturers making them just for kids. Same with the seat BTW.
9- Brakes are nice brakes but SRAM levers are too long for kids (I've tried this). Shimano's levers are better for sure or Maguras with shorter lever. Hayes Dominions are by far the best by a MILE along with their kids specific SFL lever...but no one spec's these so easy to overlook.
In the end, yeah kids can ride this and shred. I see kids doing nutty stuff on poorly spec'd bikes all the time but that doesn't mean those are proper fitted/spec bikes. But if it was my money with the current options out there for 3400$...hard pass on this. You can do better. Fwiw YT's Primus 24" is 1999$ at this moment for pre-order (Jan 2022). And the suspension and geometry (most important) are WAY better. Norco's FS1 is a much better spec as well in suspension and geo but like 3300$. I'd do that in a heartbeat over this silly thing. I can't stress enough how REDICULOUSLY nice that JUnit line is, especially the fork. Its beyond what most adults are riding today because of the internals and custom tune. There is literally nothing else that comes close to it. In a 26" yeah things get tricky, tho there is a kids 26" Reba I think that is nice (spawn used this). Norco FS1, Commencal Clash, YT Primus are all better bikes and cheaper. If we didn't expect/ask for more out manuf with kids bikes, we'd still be stuck with the Specialized Riprock junk. This feels like a fancy step back rather than a step forward.
For reference:
-Under 100% antisquat at even minimal sag and a forward axle path? Dude, move the main pivot up 10-20mm! WTF! Who designs for 80 or 90% antisquat for riders who *love* to stand up and mash and forget to shift a lot?
-64 HTA is going to make this hard for most kids to ride up anything in control. If your grom shreds A-line, fine, great bike for that. 95% of kids are basically doing XC, though, and this thing is going to wander all the heck over the place on anything that isn't fast/steep down. Maybe it's intended to be an enduro/DH sled only, I guess.
-The NX cranks are too long and can only take a 30t ring. A lot of kids are better off with a 26 or 28. Walking sucks even when your dad carries your bike. It sucks for your dad too, don't ask how I know.
-Shimano/SRAM minimum spec for 11 and 12 speed MTB drivetrains is around 42cm chainstay. You can go shorter and make it work but sometimes things do get funky (my daughter has a 39cm chainstay 24" full suspension bike and we had to take a cog off a 10 speed cassette to make it work well)
-Shimano brakes/levers are ideal for kids and the M6000 series stuff costs nothing, too.
-That J-Unit is a great fork and using a RS 27.5 is just bonkers. Kids like their bars high, but not that high. Might have been an availability issue, though - it took me 8 months to get that fork last year.
-The OneUp droppers work down to about 40 pounds and they're nice and short. Couple with the Wolf Tooth light action lever. The LEV is fine too, of course.
-There was no need to add complexity, cost, and weight with the 4-bar design here. A straight old school single pivot would have worked great and weighed less. And it wouldn't make as much noise/break as much when a kid drops it for the 80th time when she sees a shiny thing in the woods.
This compares unfavorably with other options already on the market. Bummer.
-W
- My kids on a custom Clash 24" and a fairly high level grom (15ft gaps off 6ft near vert ramps by 2nd grade). Its a 65d HTA. He's a talented climber because of his genetics and bike handling skills...but the bike works well at everything so far, but hard to tell with kids. My thought was that, since these 20/24"kids forks are so short, that the slacker HTA has less of an impact because the front wheel isn't as far away from the hands as a long 29er fork. Wondering what your more expert take is? Perhaps a 64d hta on kids bike is more like a 65d HTA on a trail bike like 5010 etc?
- Fwiw we've been rocking a SRAM X01 10-42 11sp cassette with Shimano XT 11sp RD/Shifter. Its been flawless on the 390mm chainstays. Like really good.
-I tried a OneUp V2 Dropper recently for my younger kid and it wouldn't work at a PSI low enough to handle 55lbs. Return got stuck all the time and the lever was difficult with WT Light Action. The KS Lev was lightyears better and uber smooth. My younger 6yro kid can press it down with his hand. I also tried the little BikeYoke Rascal but its actuated by the housing, not the cable and on my sons bike the housing is VERY cramped and wouldn't move to actuate.
Manitou suspension and other grom components are amazing.
We went with Vpace 135 cranks on Fluid 24 - amazing and huge weight saving along with BB (see my post above).
Agree on drive train - we went with 28 ring and 11-42 cassette and even 7 y.o. can climb techie stuff. Number of gears not as important (10 is plenty), range is. They do not need 50 plate.
Norco's trans-X light action dropper works well from 22-23kg. not sure if you can get it aftermarket, must be way cheaper than KS options.
Agree on bars - went with the thinnest lock-ons for the 10 y.o. and 7 y.o. has a bar tape instead of grips on standard bar.
Agree on brakes - we went with Deore on Fluid and Vpace comes with Maguras.
That said, every kid is different and they can adapt to almost anything.
Front center on this particular bike is probably something like 650mm (I'm too lazy to calculate it out but it'll be close to that) and on a medium/large adult bike it would be more like high 700s/low 800s for similar geometry. So disproportionately long (only ~15% shorter) for the kid as compared to saddle/bar height which is going to be MUCH lower - most of the kids that would fit on the the Minor Threat would probably be at ~50cm saddle height as compared to ~75 for an average adult male.
So in effect, it's like you/me riding a Pole or something similar. VERY long and slack. Now, that might be great for what you ride, but I think most people would agree it's not great for most people/situations.
That's weird that you couldn't make the OneUp dropper work. They have been great for my kids.
-W
The chirping from the cheap seats is missing the big picture. Company builds serious bike for kids who can utilize said bike. Some people may buy it for kids that can't utilize it - their money, their decision. Price point is freaking amazing relative to what the industry is at these days for kids bikes or adult bikes. Rather than giving them a high five for putting real energy into a total niche product y'all are complaining that it's not what you would have built. Easy solution to that...build your own.
For less money (YT is like 1300$ less) you can get a vastly superior spec. Even if price wasn't an issue you chose that (or others) over this. Plus the spec on this bike is actually flawed, not just "average". A 27.5 adult 140mm fork on a 24" bike is flat out stupid when the JUnit Pro 24" is there and freaking ridiculously nice. I can't stress this enough, the components they passed on are ridiculously nice, nicer than many adult components and purpose built for little ultra-shredders like Harry Schofield and everyone else. The rear triangle is flat-out too long, on both sizes. period. It has an impact on kids capabilities and their ability to develop important fundamentals. No kids bike is perfect, but this one just has way to many issues. The whacky rear triangle and the junky suspension (relative to others) can't be overlooked. Sure its fine, but hell Little Shredders (awesome pioneering dude) did a better job at this a DECADE ago in his garage with custom tuned Fox suspension and decent geometry. This is a big step down from even that old school rig (which some of was built for Goldstone's DH riding at one point).
I think its important to highlight design issues (its PB after all), especially for kids scene because most parents don't know what works and what doesn't. The reality is that its just better to support a brand who didn't half-ass the spec and mess up some critical geometry. Your kid will be riding a much better bike and you'll likely save a bit of cash.
If you've got time to wait, this Clash is pretty sick pre-order for gnarly stuff. They fixed the cranks too over the years (nice light ones now 145mm), KS dropper, SDG kids seat, Protaper kids bars/grips, sick geo, JUnit Pro 145mm 24" (lighter lowers and better spring than ours), nice Spank wheels, solid/tunable RS Super Deluxe that'll handle longer DH runs and has the nicer Debonair setup that works better for low PSI, Shimano brakes, Maxxis tires etc. Hardly anything to replace. Basically a nice custom build. 3899$ CAD
www.commencalcanada.com/PBSCCatalog.asp?ActionID=67174912&PBCATID=3872710
boingboing.net/2020/06/09/watch-a-bunch-of-5th-graders-s.html
Kid: "There's a Red Crested Joat's Warbler"
Adult: (scurries off, finds old bike listed on PB Buy/Sell for the national debt of Bolivia & cries).
Dunno. I currently destroy them on bikes, and they tell me to shut up about the birds…
We are doomed
gothamist.com/food/mackaye-mildly-endorses-minor-threat-hot-sauce
Johnny Rotten: Gained 100 pounds and swung to the looney right.
Henry Rollins: Got much crabbier with age.
Morrissey: See Johnny Rotten
H.R. - Hit over the head repeatedly with the crazy homophobia stick.
"I don't need a dropper on my enduro bike that has an Eagle drivetrain" - said nobody ever.
EDIT: Also the On One Codiene
It's just a tip of the hat to the band, hopefully more kids check them out.
Regarding the statement in the post "Aluminum has a lower strength-to-weight ratio than steel".
This is absolutely untrue.
Material properties:
6066 aluminum yield strength = 359 Mpa & density = 2.72 g/cc
4130 steel yield strength = 435 Mpa & density = 7.85 g/cc
6066 aluminum has a strength to weight ratio that is 240% times that of 4130 alloy steel.
The incredible strength to weight ratio of some aluminum alloys is one of the reasons that make it so well suited to bicycle (and aircraft) components.
Other properties of aluminum that make it favorable to steel for bicycles are its superior corrosion resistance and ease with which to cast, forge and machine. It is also easily weldable and a low cost material.
The principal advantages of steel over aluminum are it is very low cost and ease of welding. This is why the absolute cheapest bicycles are always made with a steel frame, and as many steel parts as possible, and why these cheap bikes are so heavy.
There are of course many very well designed and made steel frames, like Chromag, but for bicycles frames, when you compare the numbers, aluminum is the better material.
- im struggling struggling with both points
- i own a "dentist" carbon fiber bike whose name shall remain untyped
cheers!
And it is a great ride!
other that that - top! will be sold out like a hot cakes;
Seriously, the gearing really helps if you do a lot of climbing.
-150 respect Chromag.
Come to think of it how much did they give the Cro-mags when they set up shop?
I like the punking up of mountain biking but I'm feeling uneasy here...
Better yet - put your money where your mouth is and get after it - I'm sure there's a large market of people who are just as concerned as you are.