Staff Rides: Matt Wragg's Workhorse YT Decoy 29
STAFF RIDES
Matt Wragg's YT Decoy 29
Matt Wragg's YT Decoy 29
This bike is like a big, shaggy dog. I’m not sure YT’s marketing department will be too excited about that description, but it works for me. Its on-trail manners lean towards smash rather than finesse, it’s always ready to go and it always puts a smile on my face.
I’m not going to go down the “Why do I ride my eMTB most?” line here. I enjoy it. What more do you need to know? The Decoy 29 has been in my stable since last April, and I have notched up around 1,500km in that time - further than I have ridden any of my MTBs in a year during the past decade.
I’m not going to go down the “Why do I ride my eMTB most?” line here. I enjoy it. What more do you need to know? The Decoy 29 has been in my stable since last April, and I have notched up around 1,500km in that time - further than I have ridden any of my MTBs in a year during the past decade.
Decoy Details
• Intended use: riding
• Travel: 155mm rear / 160mm fork
• Wheel size: 29"
• Reach: 462mm
• 65° head angle, 458mm chainstays
• yt-industries.com
• Intended use: riding
• Travel: 155mm rear / 160mm fork
• Wheel size: 29"
• Reach: 462mm
• 65° head angle, 458mm chainstays
• yt-industries.com
Why This Bike?
First off, I wanted a full 29. Mullet bikes are probably great, and in the name of curiosity I have the bits to try this as a mullet at some point, but I want my main wheels all in 29-inch.
Since 27.5" wheels and Boost hubs started infiltrating the market in 2014 or so my parts store has been in chaos. It is only in the last year or so I have got back to a point where all of my wife's and my bikes finally run the same axle diameter, axle width, and rim diameters again. When I break something, I want to grab a wheel off another bike and keep riding, not spend my life trying to marry one part to another from the ever-expanding web of ‘standards’. I want to pop the front tire on the back when it starts to wear down. So, 29.
Geometry
Surprisingly for a brand with such a wild image, the Decoy is a fairly moderate bike. This large has a stated 462mm reach, which is short by today's standards, especially for a large, but at 5'9' / 1.75m it fits me so well. I have run bikes from 409-485mm reaches in the last few years and this is a sweet spot for me.
Beyond that, I knew the chainstays were suitably long. I spent the summer on a 435mm-chainstayed enduro bike and spent the entire time bitching about it. I wouldn’t want to go below a 440mm chainstay on any of my bikes anymore, and I still don’t understand the people who claim not to be able to manual these bikes. It was only looking through the geometry charts for this article that I discovered that this bike has a 458mm chainstay, some 8mm longer than I expected. Yet thanks to the bar height and riding position (which YT do a great job of out of the box), it has always popped quite pleasingly and we don't want for tight corners here in the South of France.
It has a head angle. I think it’s 65-ish, but I honestly don’t care. The BB was nice and low out of the box, with maybe one or two too many pedal strikes in the low setting. It definitely has a seattube angle and all the other measurements, but the fact is that the bike just feels like it fits me really well.
A Shimano E8000 paired with a 540Wh battery sit inside the frame.
What About the Motor and Battery?
The bike runs on the older Shimano E8000 motor and a 540Wh custom battery, which is just fine. Yes, the EP8 and the Bosch G4 are newer, sexier motors, but if you’re riding for yourself, how much does that matter? My wife has been running an EP8-equipped bike and you can definitely see the gains running side-by-side. That said, I don’t think it’s worth changing the bike just for the newer motor, the E8000 is still a decent bit of kit.
The advantage this bike has over Shimano-powered bikes with standard batteries is the firmware. On standard bikes, Shimano’s firmware holds onto the last 20% of the battery, I believe to save battery to power lights. YT has a far more focused view of how this bike will be ridden and strip this out. This means you get a fair bit more range than on a stock 504Wh Shimano battery. Weighing 70kg, I can get around 1,000m climbing in Boost, plenty for an hour clearing my head after work. If I drop the power down a little, around 1,500m is doable in Trail, enough for 2-3 hours of fun.
Up front is a 160mm Fox 38 with a GRIP2 damper, and a Marzocchi CR2 coil with a 400lb spring handles the rear end.
Suspension
For the first six months with this bike, I ran the stock suspension, which only changed when my wife was no longer using the Marzocchi CR2 coil I bought her for our roadtrip. It is a 65mm stroke shock, rather than the 60mm-stroke stock DPX2, which bumps the travel to somewhere around the 155mm mark (although don’t expect YT to be too happy you did this if you need to warranty your bike).
Having spent several years trying to get my bikes perfect, this shock was a bit of a departure for me. Arriving with a generic tune, it went on with the spring my wife was running (400lb) and I fiddled with the preload and LSC a little. It just works. When I took the bike to a DH track, I could start to see the edges. But for everyday riding around where we live, I get comfort and can still throw the bike around when I want to. It may not be tuned to win an EWS, but I don't need that level of performance to have fun. I should probably buy a fancier spring for it, I may even give a progressive-wound spring a try as the frame is a shade less progressive than I would prefer with the coil. We’ll see.
The longer-stroke shock changed the balance of the bike and the stock 150mm 36 started to feel a little under-gunned. I planned to pop a 160mm air shaft in there, but Fed Ex managed to lose it somewhere between the UK and here. Fortunately, as you do, I had a 160mm 38 going spare, so that went on instead. From the box the bike came with a big 10mm+ topcap/spacer, so to keep the cockpit constant for climbing I took that out and slammed the stem.
The 38 is a very, very impressive fork in this Factory GRIP2 guise, as my colleagues have said many times, but I can’t help thinking that I don’t need that much fork. The stock 36 was stiff enough for my 70kg weight, and I don’t think another 10mm of travel will change that. If this were a regular bike I would probably keep the 38 on, but for my eMTB, I keep coming back to the fact that lower weight = more range, ie. more fun, although maybe having a big, impractical fork is exactly how this bike should be built...
The bike rolls on a set of DT Swiss HX1501 wheels shod with Schwalbe Magic Mary and Big Betty, both in a SuperGravity casing.
Wheels and Tires
When I wrote about living with an eMTB long-term, back in 2017, I described wheels as “semi-disposable.” DT Swiss have proved me wrong on that front. The HX1501s on this bike run on utterly dependable 240 hubs and a reinforced version of the rim that won our product of the year last year. In honesty, I’m not sure how many bikes these wheels have been on - it is certainly the second bike they have graced, it could well be more.
Switching rear tires from a Schwalbe Eddy Current to the Big Betty was a revelation last year. Maybe the Eddy Current is ahead of its time, but for me, the rubber is too hard, even if their life is fantastic. The Big Betty looks similar enough, but uses a slightly softer rubber that brakes well, breaks away predictably, and still lasts impressively - I got around 1,200 km from my first rear tire this year. On the front is an ever-dependable Magic Mary. Both are in SuperGravity casing as I firmly believe that the fastest tire is rarely the lightest, but the one with air still inside it.
Inside is an Effetto Mariposa tire saver strip and their Vegelatex fluid. After interviewing Nico Vouilloz last year about his bike setup, I decided to give the low pressures he runs a go - I’m down to 19 psi up front and 21 psi in the back. Friends I rode with were freaked out by such low pressures, but I think they could be pushed further. I’m not the most assiduous at checking tire pressures before a ride, so I have likely ridden at even lower pressures. I mostly ride without tubes or a pump, and the only times I have had to limp home are when I have let the pressures drop too far or the sealant has gone off, usually after about 6 months of neglect.
Brakes are an XTR/XT 4-piston combo, pedals are XT, contact points are Ergon and a Renthal cockpit finishes the bike off.
Other Parts
The XTR/XT 4 piston brake combo came about after a minor mishap with the stock Codes, but it has been interesting to run SRAM and Shimano back-to-back after several years on Formula. Shimano handle the rest of the transmission - the bike arrived with a full XT group - although when the derailleur met a rock I popped a Deore one on there instead. Shimano also provides the pedals with these XTs. Originally I was running the current generation of pedal on this bike, but I went steaming into another large rock with them and these older pedals were waiting in the parts box.
Cockpit is a Renthal Fatbar Carbon (780mm/30mm) and Apex stem (40mm). In the future, I am debating as to which Renthal bar I would run. In the past, the Fatbar was perfect for me, but they upped it to 800mm in the last few years. That means that when I cut it back to 780mm it is a touch stiffer than the previous generation. The dilemma is whether to sacrifice another 20mm of width to go with the 760mm Fatbar Lite, which should be more comfortable and a touch lighter.
Ergon provides the contact points. This carbon-railed Team SM saddle is another item that has been with me through multiple bikes. Grips are their GD1s, not the current version. I actually have a box of the newer Evo grips here with me and they are better grips, but these still feel so good that they will stay on while there is life left in them.
YT’s in-house Postman dropper has been fine - it made a fun sliding noise when it was new that I rather miss. I know the cool kids are all running long-drop posts now, but I seem to have missed that party and I have never felt like a 150mm post has held me back. The frame-specific water bottle holds about enough for my shorter spins, and I should take a backpack for the longer ones anyway. And finally, a PB Marsh Guard to finish it all off.
How's It Ride?
Have you ever had a bike that just clicked from the first ride? For me, the Decoy did that. I have always preferred support over comfort from my suspension, so the poppy, direct nature of the bike really works for me. Even if I then put on the coil for extra comfort and the bigger fork for more smash. While that makes it a slightly different beast from what you can buy off the shelf, it doesn't feel like it has compromised the maneuverability that made me appreciate this bike from the beginning. When I have had a stressful day I want a bike that I can just grab and go - and for me, that is this bike.
In fact, I like this bike so much, I have convinced YT to let me hold onto it for the next two years. The plan is to check back in about this bike and look at how eMTBs really are to live with, in the long term. For instance, what is the service life of one of these batteries? How do the motors hold up? If there is anything you'd particularly like to know about living with an eMTB, please let me know in the comments
Author Info:
Must Read This Week
Sign Up for the Pinkbike Newsletter - All the Biggest, Most Interesting Stories in your Inbox
PB Newsletter Signup
...is the micro bottle for water or for chainlube?
That’s what she said…
I'm with you on tyre pressure too, with better casings or inserts. I need to keep a close eye on pressures though.
But to keep four bikes kind of the same, parts wise, is not an easy thing during kids growing up and you don't and can't just buy all the stuff, new every half a yera because the grow up and need good performance. It is not only the parts, but also the different tools you need to keep everything in shape.
Besides this I'm absolutely happy with my Decoy. I'm changing my setup from 29" with Trust Shout to 27.5" with Zocchi Z1 coil depending on riding style. Rear 27.5" using a good old Vivid Air. Tyres 2.4 to 2.8".
Good times!
So while I agree, that it's an issue, it's hardly catastrophic for the class. And I'm sure as it keeps developing, more standardization will come into play. So it seems like mostly a minor annoyance down the road, than a deal breaker to me.
Though from most reports it seems the motors are the major weak point on almost all ebikes, so maybe after care several years after purchase of the motor is the main talking point?
As far as motors being the weak point, yeah I think that's fair. I was actually on a ride yesterday with a guy on a Decoy and his motor crapped out. Though tbf, he hacked the damn thing to get rid of the top speed limit
I think to keep a current ebike going for 5-10 years is going to require proper motor servicing or a reconditioned one.
I know some people get bent out of shape about designing bikes to fit bottles (Aston comes to mind), but I'm genuinely baffled why.
Why - other than unique look and marketing - would we need any other frame layouts than the basic vertical shock or low shock (a'la SC, Range, Giga) that have plenty of space in the frame, can be adapted to whatever system you want: 4-bar horst link, 4 bar short link, 6-bar (like DW6), linkage driven SP, high pivot, you name it, and allow for all the tinkering with curves, leverages, AS, AR etc.? Where's the compromise here?
Does this YT's bog-standard horst link actually work better than any other bike's bog-standard horst link just because of that funny bottle?
What can really make our suspension better at this point is shock technology, not weird frame layouts straight outta the late 90s (not saying that's what YT does but that would be one reason to ditch standard bottles).
Whether you personally use it or not, the ability to put a standard bottle in a frame is objectively adding convenience while arguments against seem to be rather perceived.
I have not been so lucky with DT Swiss as my m1700 rims got annihilated in around 6 months (rebuilding with a more solid rim) and a big Betty wears out in a handful of summer epics (200-300km) although I run them to the ground over 1000km by which time they are slicks...
This also is the same for some other parts of the bike, like suspension, brakes, tyres, and gearing.
The bike gets its "CE conform" badge in the original configuration with the parts specced when it's delivered to the customer.
You're not allowed to diverge from the original tyre size (in mm), or use suspension with different travel as this would alter the geometry. Brake rotors have to stay the same size (at least in the rear) and the motor will produce error codes if the gears are different from what's specced in the firmware.
You may, though, use components with a different spec, if these should be used in a different model of the same bike.
For example, the DECOY Mullet bike is sold with an air shock and a coil shock. This means you can swap between air and coil as you like, but you will have to stick to the original length and travel of the rear shock.
That is why @mattwragg said that YT will most likely not be happy about the suspension swap he did, as the coil shock has 5mm more travel than originally specced.
Of course, you can do all that, if you like. It's all possible from a technical POV. But you will have to deal with the consequences, once things go south.
Also, will the motor have wear and tear items inside it that require replacing over time or need to send for service, etc.?
Thx
The motors are sealed units because of the strict legal restrictions around these class 1 bikes. I'd imagine if you start opening them there is a whole world of hacking they want/need to discourage. Remember that by being in class 1 these bikes are allowed on cycle lanes with regular bikes, something that adds much value for urban users.
How is the clearance with the 65mm shock stroke on the low setting? I have the same bike in XL and I have checked a 65mm shock on the low position and the seat tube is dangerously close to the rear triangle at full compression...
I guess you had the 36 ebike specific, if yes do you notice a difference in stiffness compared to the regular 36? Is it really below a 38?
Cheers !
I don't know which 36 I have, there is an ebike one with a reinfirced chassis and one with a regular chassis but heavier damper tune and I can never tell them apart. At the end of the day, I was talking to Martin Maes about Fox forks last summer and he chooses the 36 usually, so I reasoned that it may be an ebike, but he's going a bit faster than me.
Thanks for the answer
yes might be a tolerance thing, or the bike size. It passes on mine but with like 2mm left between the two carbon parts so I was thinking might be risky if the frame deforms a little under compression.
The original fork on the decoy 29 was the ebike one with the thicker stanchions and the fox34 air shaft. I haven't tried the other models so I can't compare but I am really happy with mine, just bleed the grip2 after 1.5years and feels great again !
Have you found any way to deal with it?
The alternative would have been to get a mullet, but there are the same factors you mentioned, having to get two rear wheels relaced, can’t use the same tires etc.
The weird thing with long chainstays is effective front axle is further way so when you turn, the bike will tend to push and understeer - chainstays have to be matched with BB height and trail/front centre.
Look at the marin alpine 2021/22, its short CS, slack asf but turns on a dime, I can quite often turn too much an the wheel will fold under because of the front grip.
It's a lot of work to get around the bike and move my weight.
That's why my future bike will have longer chainstays
Ergon - please take the carbon railed SM-Enduro into production!
I run it in the high setting though. Somehow the suspension feels better in high and pedal clearance is imporant on tech uphill for me.
As far as I can work out, it's absolutely pointless, especially on eBikes
want to copy-paste
HAHA