Review: Trust Shout Linkage Fork - Does Different Mean Better?
The Shout is the second entry into Trust's linkage fork lineup, a longer travel version of the Message fork that debuted back in 2018. Like its shorter sibling, it's constructed almost entirely from carbon fiber, including the one-piece upper legs and steerer tube assembly.
The Shout is air-sprung, with 178mm of 'contour travel', and Trust says that the fork can replace a 160 – 180mm telescoping fork. Contour travel refers to the path the front wheel takes as the fork is compressed; with this design there's a curved axle path, as opposed to the linear path of a telescoping fork.
The fact that there's no brake arch to get in the way of a tire means that the Shout can work with both 27.5” and 29” wheels, but keep in mind that it has a 580mm axle to crown measurement, a number that's typically seen on a 160mm 29” fork.
The Shout is air-sprung, with 178mm of 'contour travel', and Trust says that the fork can replace a 160 – 180mm telescoping fork. Contour travel refers to the path the front wheel takes as the fork is compressed; with this design there's a curved axle path, as opposed to the linear path of a telescoping fork.
The fact that there's no brake arch to get in the way of a tire means that the Shout can work with both 27.5” and 29” wheels, but keep in mind that it has a 580mm axle to crown measurement, a number that's typically seen on a 160mm 29” fork.
Shout Fork Details
• 178mm contour travel
• Air-sprung
• Carbon chassis, aluminum pivots
• Externally adjustable rebound, low-speed compression
• Axle-to-crown: 580mm
• 250-hour service interval
• 15 x 110mm Boost spacing
• Lifetime bearing warranty
• Weight: 2,160-grams (actual)
• MSRP: $1,975 USD
• www.trustperformance.com
• 178mm contour travel
• Air-sprung
• Carbon chassis, aluminum pivots
• Externally adjustable rebound, low-speed compression
• Axle-to-crown: 580mm
• 250-hour service interval
• 15 x 110mm Boost spacing
• Lifetime bearing warranty
• Weight: 2,160-grams (actual)
• MSRP: $1,975 USD
• www.trustperformance.com
The actual weight for our test fork was 2160 grams with an uncut steerer tube. The price? $1,975 USD. Where do those numbers place it compared to other options in this category? Well, a 29" RockShox Lyrik Ultimate weighs in at 2000 grams and costs $999 USD, while a Fox 36 Factory weighs 2020 grams and goes for $1,065 USD.
There are three compression settings, and it's possible to fine-tune the open and middle setting.
Chassis Details
Installing the Shout on a bike is a guaranteed method of attracting loads of questions and curious glances. Its appearance can be visually jarring, partially due to the fact that the positioning of the Shout's oversized carbon fiber legs makes it looks as if the bike it's installed on has an incredible slack head tube angle. That's just an illusion, though; take a look at where the front axle is in relation to the head tube and you'll see that it's in roughly the same place it would be on a telescoping fork.
The left leg holds an air spring, which is accessed by flipping open a rubber plug on the side of the leg and then removing the air cap with a 4mm hex wrench, a step I wish wasn't required. Sure, air pressure adjustments are going to be more common during the initial set up period, but it's still more of a hassle than having an air valve at the top of the fork.
Rebound is adjusted at the bottom of the right leg...
...And compression adjustments are hidden under a rubber plug in the middle of the same leg.
Another air spring is located in the right leg, along with a twin-tube damper. Just like on the left leg, there's a rubber plug that covers the air valve, except that there's also a second rubber plug that provides access to the compression adjustments. There are 20 clicks of open-mode compression, and 5 clicks of medium-mode compression. Those modes are selected via the silver lever at the top of the fork. There's also a third mode, firm, but the amount of compression for that setting is not adjustable. Rebound damping is adjusted by turning the red dial at the bottom of the right leg.
Huck Pucks can be added or subtracted to adjust the amount of ramp-up, but it's not the quickest procedure.
Along with the compression and rebound adjustments, it's also possible to adjust the amount of end-stroke ramp up by adding or subtracting 'Huck Pucks' to each leg. It's a similar concept to what most telescoping forks use these days, although the process is more involved than just opening up a top cap and adding a spacer or two. The air spring and damper need to be removed from each leg to accomplish this task - you're looking at closer to a 20-minute job instead of two minutes, and it's not something that can easily be done trailside. The Shout comes with three Huck Pucks already installed, and it can accommodate up to two more, for a total of five.
Suspension Design
What exactly happens when the Shout is compressed? Well, it's a little different than what happens with a telescoping fork. Rather than traveling in a linear manner, the wheel moves up and back, away from the impact. This motion effectively changes the offset, the distance between the axle and the steering axis. A change in offset also alters the amount of trail, the distance between the tire's contact patch and the steering axis. In theory, the result of the increasing trail number as the fork compresses should result in more stability, by helping to balance out the steepening head angle as the fork goes into its travel.
Maintenance
Trust says that the Shout shouldn't need any servicing until 250 hours of ride time is reached. For reference, that number is double the recommended interval for a Fox 36. There's also a lifetime warranty on the fork's cartridge bearings. After 4 months of use the bearings in our test fork are still smooth, and the carbon legs have survived countless rough trails without any damage.
Set Up
Trust's set up materials are outstanding – the illustrations and instructions in the included booklet are clear and easy to understand, no matter your level of mechanical know-how. Once the fork is installed, the next step is to set the air pressure in each leg and then the low-speed compression and rebound.
For my 160 pound weight I settled on 155 psi in each leg, 14 – 18 clicks out on compression depending on conditions, and 17 clicks out on rebound. Those settings are all within 4 clicks of what Trust recommends – I ended up running slightly less compression and faster rebound than their suggested base settings.
Keep in mind that the ol' parking lot squish test isn't always the best indicator of how things will feel out on the trail, and that's especially true with the Shout. It's best to find a short section of trail and take repeated runs to figure out your preferred set up.
Our test fork spent time on a Banshee Titan, Norco Sight, and a Kona Process 153.
Performance Report
I've been testing the Shout for the last four months on a wide range of terrain, everything from smooth flow trails to chunky, steep, and natural tracks. I wasn't the only one that spent time on this fork, either; two other testers were involved in order to get a wider range of opinions on its strengths and weaknesses.
Smooth Jumps & Flowy Bermed Trails
This is where the Shout felt best. On bermed corners, the fork stayed nice and high in its travel, which made it easy to really trust the front-end (no pun intended) and push even harder through the turn. That trait was also helpful on bigger jumps, where the lack of dive made it possible to get a little more loft off the lip. In these instances the fact that it didn't feel like a typical 160mm fork was a benefit – there wasn't any excessive movement, and it was very responsive to quick direction changes.
Its takeoff performance was admirable, but landings didn't always feel as good as I'd hoped. There were times when the fork felt buttery smooth, typically while touching down onto a steeper transition, and then there were other moments when it felt as if there was barely any travel at all. One of those instances occurred when I came in for a landing from a decent-sized stepdown. I landed a little rear-wheel heavy, and when the front end came down it sent an unexpected jolt through my arms, with more of a 'thwang' than the 'squoosh' that I was expecting, to use some super-scientific terminology.
That happened on smaller drops and jumps as well – at times it didn't mute impacts nearly as much as I'd anticipated. This wasn't due to air pressure or lack of volume spacers either – the amount of travel I was using was in line with the size of the impacts, and I still had a little left over on all but the biggest hits.
Steep Terrain
The Shout's performance in steep terrain was a mixed bag. On smoother steeps – picture a twisty dirt chute without too many obstacles in it – it performed quite well, with a noticeable lack of dive compared to a telescoping fork. Even though the wheel was contouring to the ground, my weight wasn't getting pulled towards the front of the bike, making it easier to remain in a centered, neutral position. That feeling of calm control is addictive, and some of my favorite moments aboard the Shout occurred while navigating steep, twisty sections of trail.
However, add in some chunkiness to that steep chute and the story begins to change. The lightly damped initial portion of the Shout's travel usually isn't that noticeable when the fork is weighted, since the fork sags past that point, but when riding stair-step like sections of trail, which involve moments when the fork was repeatedly weighted and then unweighted, that initial free play could make it feel like something was loose. I stopped more than once to confirm that yes, my headset was tight. I wasn't the only one that encountered this – other testers noticed the same sensation.
In the Rough
The Shout tracks very well through rough terrain, with an impressive ability to plow straight through obstacles without getting knocked off line. However, it never felt as comfortable as a RockShox Lyrik or Fox 36 when dealing with repeated sharp impacts. It's tough to say whether it was the oversized carbon legs or the compression tune that was making me notice more feedback in my hands and forearms, but either way, in really rough terrain it wasn't the plushest ride.
There's also the fact that with a telescoping for it's relatively easy to anticipate what the front wheel will do when an obstacle is encountered. Hit a rock and it'll move in a predictable, linear fashion. With the Shout, this isn't the case, and different impact angles and speeds can cause it to react quite differently. Not being able to accurately predict what the fork will do can be challenging; there were moments when the Shout would go deeper into its travel than I expected, and others when it felt like it barely moved. This meant I ended up paying more attention to what the fork was doing, rather than being able to put it to the back of my mind and concentrate on the ride itself.
Trust Performance's Response
 | Shout was designed to provide riders with unparalleled traction, stability, and control at speed. It wasn’t designed to mimic the feel of a traditional telescopic fork. It’s a linkage system—a fundamentally different platform that allows the front of your bike to reap the benefits the rear has for years. So, hell yes it feels different! Sure, you may feel sensations you’ve never felt before—but that’s performance at work. If you can ditch your years of telescopic experience and accept that Trust suspension will change how you ride, it’ll likely come down to this: looking for something that’s soft and comfortable? Get yourself a Buick. But if you can handle high-speed and crave performance, get a Porsche. Here at Trust, it's straightforward: we're all about riding and making shit for those who like to go fast. |
Pros
+ Excellent cornering performance
+ Very composed on steep, smooth trails
Cons
- Not the most comfortable ride feel
- Expensive
- Heavier than its direct competition
Pinkbike's Take
| If the Shout's on-trail performance trounced that of a traditional telescoping fork it'd be easier to look past its price, weight, and looks. Unfortunately, that's not the case. While there are intriguing elements to its handling, they're not quite enough to outshine the current crop of high-end telescoping forks on the market. |
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And shitload poorer.
Hell, maybe stick with a $60 craigslist find cause you won’t go twice the speed on a $120 craigslist find either. Basically sounds like you should get the cheapest rideable bike you can find and call it a day? Cause as long as it has gears, you won’t find a 2x speed boost from anything really
As for the fork, it shines over a traditional fork in a couple specific areas, but overall, as of now a telescoping fork is better for diverse terrain riding.
Yeah, but when has he ever not been manualing?
yeah, this kind of arrogance is def not what I would like to see from a manufacturer.
Are we talking quality here?
Gergely has uploaded a file to the public library that agrees closely with my own. Let me know if you want to discuss this or ... ahem ... "other" front linkage products and we can continue via email.
Yep. Totally agree. Very interested in the concept but their poor marketing speech serve themselves badly...
They wish to compare to Porsche, so it will be very interesting to see them stand behind that on a timed section back to back with a 36 or lyrik. Until proven, I find their assertions very pretentious considering the technical solutions thatc actually works in MTB and other sports, like MX/SX, moto rally, etc...
Even BMW, which is presently the only maker producing rocker-and-pivot based front suspension anti-dive system use telescopic stanchions and a monopivot rocker, not a horst-link system...
My suspicion is the problems are due to trying to use an unconventional damper to work around less-than-ideal kinematics. It should be possible to do so, but it's clearly not easy and, if this is correct, we can hope for continued improvement with each iteration.
Linkage forks essentially eliminate binding and allow the designer to separate the other variables. Linkages also allow for a tailored axle path. I'm not sure what the ideal axle path is, but I know it's not a perfectly straight line.
This are some of the reasons why linkage forks have a higher maximum performance potential, but they also create a lot more opportunities to get it wrong and make a worse product. Given as much development time as telescoping forks have had, I think linkage forks should be able to take the lead. Keep in mind how much work has been put into telescoping forks!
www.instagram.com/p/B558E0rnjV0/?igshid=ee31xvd7l6xr
.
Actually, the bending seems to me a bit strange. Because the chassis must be very stiff from axle up to the crown, for the sake of accomodating the spring and damper inside of it, the bending force has to move up, up to a stronger point which is at fork crown and only then fork legs start to bend. This behaviour makes situation even worse IMO, because it delays the need for axle to move along it's 'contour'.
I wonder if engineers at TRUST has taken into account this behaviour when calculating wheel spring force rates.
Simply said, I wanted to say the fork legs should not be so evenly stiff, they should get stiffer from axle upwards. But it probably isn't safe for the spring and damper components within the legs.
That reeks of not knowing your market and is not what I'd expect from a serious engineering company.
I dont really fanboi shit. If i buy and it sucks i let everyone know it sucks.
"But if you can handle high-speed and crave performance, get a Porsche. Here at Trust, it's straightforward: we're all about riding and making shit for those who like to go fast."—Ben Craner, Marketing Manager Trust Performance
If they want to prove this new technology, why not acquire some telemetry equipment and do a side bye side review with @mikekazimer.
For the kind of terrain that mtb push hard on, maybe compare your “Trust Porsche” against a trophy truck instead and see which you would rather ride in the rough stuff.
Bad PR.
Do you think they can concede any ground marketing wise? I think they’ve gotta dig their heels in there or it’s game over. Perhaps they should have called the forks the ‘Belief’ and ‘Faith’?
Of course 4 bars systems are common on cars, but not designed with the same objectives/benefits as on bikes (wheel/axle path, anti-dive).
"The Shout has a modified damper that uses little or no compression damping in the initial part of the stroke to reduce the perception of harshness"
It's exactly the same for bikes with high AS/PK: designers lighten the compression tune of the shock to lessen the amount of forces that counteract the suspension compression, and thus diminish harshness.
I agree that you can fine tune the pivots placement to reduce harshness, but you will loose the anti-dive benefit.
For me Trust forks are based on the same conception bias or parti pris that lead to bikes with high AS/PK : having a firm platform without relying on damping.
Maybe it works for "agressive" riders with strong legs and arms that compensate for firm suspension (you know, this Richie R. guy) or those who rides perfectly smooth terrain, but for me it doesn't. I want small hits plushness backed by spring progression and rod speed dependant compression. I will pay for it.
The only place where linkage forks ever were the mainstream was in sidecar-racing, to keep the geometry stable under heavy load shifts while braking.
Wonder if their after market is as gentle as him?
@tgent: I mean motion ratio, which is the inverse of leverage ratio. When people say a bike's rear suspension is progressive, if you look at the leverage ratio curve, it's actually digressive, so I'm being more disciplined with my terminology. For example, a bike's leverage curve may go from 3:1 to 2.2:1, which is digressive. The motion ratio is 0.33 to 0.45, which is progressive. The force curve for such a linkage with a linear spring is progressive. This may feel pedantic, but I hope you can see why I'm being extra careful as we get more technical in the discussion.
With that out of the way, my point is the leverage of the Trust products behaves opposite to what we've established as desirable for rear suspension. This requires a very different spring and damper set-up from what we use on rear suspension and it seems Trust is struggling to dial it in. It may or may not be possible to achieve ideal performance with such a curve; we'll find out in a few years as Trust refines their products.
I’m really hoping for Trust be successful. It just may take a couple versions and for them to actually listen to feedback.
All the reviews just repeat themselfes over and over and complain about comfort, but comfort isnt the primary goal of this fork. It is meant to be stable, grippy and enable to go stupid fast.
I am not here to taunt anyone, but this fork isnt for the average pinkbike commenter (I am just average as well), but for people that go hard on the bike.
Have you ever felt the suspension of a serious racer or pro freerider?
They dont set their suspension up for comfort, but for going fast.
When you want to go fast that 40% sag sofa feel just wont get you very far.
Pro riders run suspension setups that match their weight, riding style and speed requirements, they don’t all run over damped / sprung forks, infant many pro enduro bikes have very ‘conventional’ setups.
Also, what’s the point in making a fork that isn’t suitable for the average PB contributor - after all that’s the customer, is it not? Pros don’t buy forks and if people as fast / doing as many miles as journalists all think the same thing - isn’t is possible they have a genuine point?
Further, why some people are so quick to have their hair raging on fire over the slightest petty perceived slights; emphasis on perceived, still baffles me. Yeah, some of that statement is unnecessary, but that’s true of most marketing schlock. So you’ll never give them a dime ever over that statement? They’re not kidding anyone and were never going to buy it for other reasons regardless or whatever else is going on inside their head. These are the same people that go Johnny Storm “flame-on” meltdown if the POTUS barely twitches his eye. It used to be called being immature. Now it’s just accepted as normal.
As for the statement, marketing is one thing, a strap line on an advert thats a bit controversial or an interview response off the cuff, but this is the marketing managers response to a review from the largest MTB community / online mag in the world. Why make this response? Either like POTUS you know it will work as a marketing strategy for your customers / base or maybe because you know what you are doing is a bit 'out there' and there isnt really a better way to respond that wont put off customers in some way / create its own comment storm.
www.mbr.co.uk/reviews/forks/trust-shout-review?fbclid=IwAR2n95QOZ11yfsriaKej5-R9eQb_Nw6KHdWX1DHj4kaXnE7VInFwBhDkfuE
As for parallels with motorcycling, on and off road - it would seem the telescopic fork has won out and that includes high end racing. There must be a reason for that.
Maybe you are exactly the right amount of brainwashed to be happy with any old shite.
X
Arguably, at near double the price of alternatives, you could say it sucks.
youtu.be/NMq2p12RkTk
came here to post this......
I fear there might be tears in my eyes were I to ride one of these
Makes me sad to say this, but I think they're doomed. Second product release in a row and they're offering something that attempts to solve issues the average user barely notices, for double the price of the competition, with no OEM deals and plenty of subpar reviews. I really wanted to see some linkage fork to succeed.
Meanwhile, one buys a Marzocchi Z1 for €500 and gets top notch performance and parts support.
I also bet RS and Fox have plenty of cards up their sleeves to keep milking the telescopic fork cow for some years, like "light" DC forks, sliding bushes or maybe damper bypasses
I still believe linkage forks have a higher maximum performance potential, but it's so difficult to break into a mature market. If a telescoping fork was released at the same $1,975 USD price point, it could have some great technology that could elevate it far above current top models, which would further weaken the value proposition of alternative designs.
The pricing "trick" may have annoyed people, but it was clearly effective and I think it was the right move. Those who purchased at the initial price have been placated with discounts - which also promote future sales - and the enormous profit margins of those early sales solidified the company's finances. Bold move and it worked.
@WAKIdesigns: it takes a special kind of person with the right combination of confidence and technical skill to come up with an out of the box idea, implement it correctly and bring it to the market. From my own personal experience, that's often the last guy you'd want in charge of marketing or PR
You get some of these on ews bikes and people see that these are faster they will sell like hot cakes. And the competition will scramble to make their own linkage forks.
Linkage are the future no where but up to go.
Telescopic can only continue to make small changes to sell them to you year after year.
But: 'Sure, you may feel sensations you’ve never felt before—but that’s performance at work.' I dunno, we all know that line is marketing w*nk but it seems a little contrived and almost defensive.
I wish them the best to crack the concept and will hope to ride it one day!
Is this a section that you rode daily? Weekly? A few times a year?
When you couldn't get it did it result in a crash? A dab? Or just stopping and walking it?
Once you were on the linkage fork did you just charge straight into the section in question and cleaned it?
Have you retried the section since o. A telescopic fork and resulted in carnage again?
Please explain.
With a Trust fork, the traction is already there inherent in the overall system of the trailing link. The weight bias is unnecessary and will cause more of a straight-line vector of the ground to the arms/shoulders leading to more trail input. If the rider changes their body position and adapts to the movement of the fork and basically rides the fork as if it were a rigid fork, the traction will come and the benefit will be noticeable along with less of a transfer of trail input.
It's the RST Titan fork of course!
rstsuspension.com/en/forks/dh-fr-am/titan-dh-fr-am
Who isn't waiting for a review?!
This hypothetical fork would just need massive fork bumpers so frame manufacturers wouldn't have a heart attack.
WARNING! Comment patent WA.KI.2020.555.555.69
Cconcenrns use of DC fork bumper in proximity of headtube on frames with less than 179mm of rear travel. Company must contact Wakidesigns before creating such frame and selling it to the public.
www.pinkbike.com/news/the-new-yt-capra-everything-you-need-to-know.html
Waiting for someone that shreds harder than me to implement one of these forks in to a 'Super-Enduro' build.
https://www.mojo.co.uk/morc-36-dc-offset-reduction-kit-1082-p.asp
I'm a 180# trail rider riding on a 65 degree HTA 160mm Lyric (which is already much stiffer than a Fox) so a DC fork would be wasted on me. However I know some big boys, that smash really hard, on a 170mm travel bike that's really slack (which effects flex), I feel these guys would be good candidates for a 180mm DC fork on their Enduro rig.
Personally like piston kit for 40 would be a better idea.
The problem for me is finding a DH bike with a not ridiculously slack seat tube angle and and straight seat tube that allows for a dropper post to be inserted. Any suggestions on compatible frames?
Still I dream of a Superfoxy with a Bartlet DC fork but in a bike that can be pedaled. Guarantee I could have a shred worthy rig like that weigh under 33#s.
Do you prefer your suspension to be thwangy or squooshy?
And is it maybe pushed more into its travel under breaking? And that is why it doesnt performe in the steep?
Otherwise the best explanation would be: Dirt Jumping does wonders for climbing!
Or the lack of brake dive.
... if you want both in one - get a coil fork.
You guys don't know much about Dave Weagle do yah? That guy could shit on your lawn and would argue it's the best looking flower in your garden.
So I’ve been riding a shout for about five months now. It’s on my megatower. I’m 5’ 10” and 150 lbs. I work full time but race pro level enduro in my spare time. Full disclosure: I’m sponsored by trust for equipment but not paid by them.
I’ve ridden this fork in hot weather, rain, mud, dry, snow, rocks, jumps, fast, slow, up, down. Every product out there has both strengths and weaknesses. One filter point I use is do those strengths line up with mine to create a better experience or not. I would not have committed to riding this fork unless I felt like it was going to improve my ride. Here are my opinions based on my experience riding this fork:
Yes it feels different than a conventional fork. It takes a little time to get used to it and to figure out the spring tune and damper settings (much like getting a new frame with different suspension platform). I settled on air spring psi equal to body weight in pounds. My rebound is set fully open. My compression settings are also fully open. As far as damper adjustments go this is actually pretty similar to how I would run a lyrik.
The chassis feels more rigid than most other current single crown forks I’ve ridden. I think this is part of what gives the fork such a planted feel in corners. That and the fact that the steering geometry is less affected when compressed versus telescoping forks.
When riding trails with average speeds of 20-30mph and big square edged bumps I was impressed by how the fork made them seem to disappear. I haven’t ridden a fork that handles this type of speed and bump better. Not even close. Maybe this is a combination of chassis rigidity and axle path?
At slower speeds and cornering through flatter rocky sections I noticed the fork was active and stable. There are no bushings in the system to bind under these loads.
In snow I notice that it has excellent tire clearance. Also it doesn’t seem to perform differently in very cold versus warm weather. I think part of this is that the chassis doesn’t rely on any type of grease or oil (I’m not counting the cartridge bearing pivots here) to keep moving smoothly. I’ve always noticed that when things get really cold telescoping forks tend to feel more sluggish. I’m sure that’s partly the spring but I think it’s also partly what the dust wipers and grease/oil do when cold. Another reason for this might be that there is no lower casting that is holding air pressure (and sometimes building pressure) like most telescoping forks. This takes away the inconsistencies that some people experience in most forks when going through big elevation or temperature changes forcing them to either just deal with it or try to bleed the pressure off. Some forks actually have bleeder valves to make this easy (FOX 40).
In short all that stuff made me realize how consistent the fork performs.
I do notice the harsher feel on flat landings. At first it bugged me. Then I realized that It wasn’t making me slower and that that type of feature is a small part of some of my rides whereas most of most of my rides are high speed bermed corners and jumps with ramped landings.
I notice that the fork is slightly less compliant over stutter bumps than other forks. This is again probably in part because the chassis is so rigid.
Let’s talk about maintenance. Most telescoping forks work best if you pull the lowers off every 50 or so hours and replace wipers/seals and oil. That’s time/and or money. How much depends on how much you do yourself. Most forks dampers require a rebuild every 100-200 hours. more time/money. The Trust is a 250 hour interval. that’s pretty sweet.
Over time I realized that the trust fork strengths lined up with mine and I really like it’s ride quality. It’s weaknesses were minor for me and my terrain.
I’ve found that there is really nothing like riding something for yourself though and forming your own opinions based on your own experience. Trust offers a 30 day return policy. Get one, ride it on your bike on your trails. Figure out if it works for you or not. Ship it back if you don’t like it. That’s pretty rad. If you end up wanting to keep it then.. well you’ve got fancy problems.
Due to the day job and kids & stuff I may not hop back on here for a bit. Apologies in advance if I’m slow to respond to something.
If at any point Trust becomes a real "problem" for the big players, they will just straight up buy them and the Trust founders will happily take the paycheck and ride off into the sunset.
so it is a matter of time I am sure.
The very first thing that you notice about the Message is the feel at the bars and the view of the trail. The solid feel is very reminiscent of a rigid fork. Holding on to the bar and applying pressure to one side then the other in a twisting manner gives a feeling of holding onto the bars of a bike with a double-crown fork. There is zero flex in the system, and I can’t emphasize this enough. There was so little flex, I needed to keep my body looser than normal.
I found that the more aggressive you are with the fork, the more rewarded by speed and stability you are. The fork just makes its own traction in every situation I threw myself at. From big rocks to pea gravel and some sand pits, the front end stayed glued and predictable, as long as I remembered to stay fluid on the bike. Lean and steer with my hips, keep my head and shoulders level with the ground and the front end would just track like it was on a rail. I stopped a few times to play with the rebound to get it just right. It was feeling a little slow for my liking, so I adjusted the rebound to 16 clicks (always begin adjustments from the closed position/full counterclockwise) and it was spot on.
So buddy boy who worked on the charger damper for the pike who then moved onto fox to work on the grip damper... Was he from Marzo originally then? Because now I'm a little confused on how this timeline works....
Im not really in the mood to go find it and then read it and find that part.
interesting information to know though!
Biggest suspension manufacturer in the world gets bested by a smaller company in financial trouble and then buys them out and uses the other manufacturer damper in their most expensive fork.
Kind of embarrassing.
Marketing like that is why I don’t like most marketing.
Don't worry, this guy is not your mechanic. He won't jam a Buick up your headtube when you ask for a more comfortable tune.
This is where the Shout felt best."
Isn't that where every fork would feel best? Surely there isn't any fork which feels better through rough stuff than it does on smooth stuff.
On a flat landing with a raked front end the forces going in to the bike are vertical (perpendicular to the Earth) meaning any raked front suspension needs to flex forward (because of it's raked angle) which a telescopic fork readily does underscored by tne Huck to Flat videos, yet the rigid chassis and the rearward path of the Trust ONLY moves rearward, so the Trust essentially doesn't move at all initially on a flat landing.
I'm sure the Trust is amazing when impacting trail obstacles head on where this rearward path is activated immediately.
Thought I’d put in my 2 cents since Mike Broderick and I, Mary McConneloug have been fortunate to have the opportunity to test out both suspension platforms by Trust Performance on the 2019 Enduro World Series race circuit.
We raced on the Message (@130mm) for most of the EWS and when Shout (178mm) became available just before the final race in Zermatt - Mike and I were stoked to give the bigger version a try… We both have enjoyed our experiences getting to know this incredible technology. It is quite different from what we knew before…
Both versions of Trust Performance’s suspension platforms are unbelievably durable and the ride characteristics that we have come to love - the stable feel, incredible cornering and traction - leaving us grinning from ear to ear as we fly down the trails. The feel of the front wheel path moving back and up makes it so the bike just hugs to the ground, gobbling up ruts and giving a solid feeling of safety and security.
We found The Message to be a fantastic smaller trail bike fork. The 130 mm of travel was great for most everything we wanted to ride, excelling in bumpy, tight winding, rooty, fast or steep trail conditions. It is well able to pick down most any gnarly chute…and it climbs notably well giving excellent traction on steep technical climbs.
The EWS race circuit holds some pretty gnarly DH sections - with big hits/jumps - we were perhaps a bit under-gunned racing with the Message on some features… (since more commonly Enduro MTB racing requires 150-180 mm of front travel) - So when ‘Shout’ was launched just before the EWS finals in Zermatt, Switzerland, we were super stoked to give it a try!
It was an epic week getting to know our new set ups in Switzerland… We had some huge days out riding - launching, cornering, braking, sliding, climbing - Putting on Shout brought our bikes to a new level of all mountain comfort. We were impressed with how good everything felt, especially on the rugged rocky stair step trails. I guess Plushness is a relative term - because to us, it was. The consistent feel of support and buttery handling on corners alongside impeccable traction turned our days out riding into a flow game!
I love the feeling of control and stability that the Shout provided in this big mountain terrain! I could just let ‘er rip as I made my way down some incredible tracks.
I might be the only female so far who has raced this new product… proud to represent and keen to share the discovery of such a ride inspiring product!!
Congratulations to Dave Weagle and his team at Trust Performance - Incredible that he could dream this up - and then create it into a reality!
BLOG - maryandmikeride.blogspot.com/2019/12/a-product-review-message-by-trust.html
Instagram - www.instagram.com/mikeandmaryride
www.instagram.com/p/B558E0rnjV0/?igshid=ee31xvd7l6xr
interesting IG post. I don't know though...Yes ANY fork will flex huck to flat, but I'd have to say that Trust flexed a whole lot more than normal forks! Check it!
www.pinkbike.com/news/field-test-13-bikes-hucked-to-flat-at-1000-fps.html
seems to apply here...
i will stick to my Buick for now.
Where do you drop your heels to plow!
Heels get dropped under braking, but at that moment you are not massively loading the front (this is a fork review), for the majority of the trail your feet (ankles) should be active but mostly flat.
Probably one of the heaviest loading points coming up at Fort Bill WC track
www.rootsandrain.com/photos/3925416
or a couple of years previous (when I trained for the race) through pinball, low and loading (this section is hard due to how loose it gets as well as a few rocks)
www.rootsandrain.com/photos/2401475
You need to ride the fork like it is a rigid fork. Stay loose, keep your shoulders level to the ground and steer with your hips. Also, don't put so much weight into the front wheel.
It is here that every negative reviewer is making a fatal mistake. The fork will find its traction in every instance, it is not necessary to put so much weight into the fork to help it gain traction.
Looks aside, I have had my Message for 7-months and am noticeably faster and more confident on it than any other fork I have used. And I went from a 150mm travel bike to a 110mm travel bike (rear) and a 36 to a Message.
The proof to everyone is to get out on a demo and ride it. Set the air to 20-psi lower than your body weight and go ride the damn thing before you say anything bad about it.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=OUsl-qb138A
The only thing im going to change is send it in to have the rebound sped up.
I've rode it on trails that ive been riding my entire life. There's no confirmation bias going on.
As far as people saying it has gotten all bad reviews that's nonsense.
The feed back I've read is like 100vs3 negative.
Thanks Mike, this ^ is the answer we were looking for.
Bearings look a similar size to rear bearings used on four-bar bikes, and they don't tend to last a full year IME (Specialized, Transition and Nukeproof all seized).
Like the USE SUB: Not really. The USE had a lot more anti-dive and the slopes of the curves are inverted.
Maybe if this fork was the same price as the market-leaders...but at double the cost...with those looks?!
It does not look appealing or usual, also more minuses then pluses;
So far the best improvement in performance for the 160-180 category is to use dual crown fork such as dorado Etc...
So yeah, works great for steep flow trails, but not great for jumping unless you land perfect.
Maybe there’s an ideal use for this fork but we don’t know where or what it is...
www.laufcycling.com/product/lauf-carbonara
May not be as much travel but very light and tough as nails!
But does my eagle eye spy a crack? 4th photo, detailing the compression adjustment. Anyone?
Eric
I don’t think it’s water but upon closer consideration I guess it could be the gloss black from the decals.... sorry!!!