Review: The 2019 Raaw Madonna is a Boutique Beauty
Raaw Mountain Bikes is a relatively new German brand headed by Ruben Torenbeek, who previously engineered at Ghost and then Scott, where he was the man behind the Hixon integrated handlebar and stem project. The Madonna is a high-end, aluminum, 160mm travel frame, built around 29" wheels. It's designed for aggressive riders that are looking for durability as well as performance. In 2017, when the Madonna was released, we had a chat to Ruben about the process.
At the time of getting the test bike, Raaw did not offer a complete package, so we custom built a bike to really test the limits of the chassis and build an EWS race-ready weapon, as well as a day-to-day bike that could climb, descend, and be neglected and keep on working. It was built with a longer travel 180mm Lyrik and 65mm stroke shock
At the time of getting the test bike, Raaw did not offer a complete package, so we custom built a bike to really test the limits of the chassis and build an EWS race-ready weapon, as well as a day-to-day bike that could climb, descend, and be neglected and keep on working. It was built with a longer travel 180mm Lyrik and 65mm stroke shock
Raaw Madonna Details
Intended use: Enduro
Rear Wheel Travel: 160mm (172mm with 65mm stroke shock)
Wheel size: 29"
Frame construction: aluminum
Sizes: M, L, XL (tested)
Colours: Raw / Black / Red
Frame weight: 3.8kg (incl. all hardware, w/o shock, size M, claimed)
Weight: 16.79kg / 37lbs (XL, Maxxis Minion DH, w/o pedals, actual)
Price: €2690 (frame kit)
Learn More: raawmtb.com
Intended use: Enduro
Rear Wheel Travel: 160mm (172mm with 65mm stroke shock)
Wheel size: 29"
Frame construction: aluminum
Sizes: M, L, XL (tested)
Colours: Raw / Black / Red
Frame weight: 3.8kg (incl. all hardware, w/o shock, size M, claimed)
Weight: 16.79kg / 37lbs (XL, Maxxis Minion DH, w/o pedals, actual)
Price: €2690 (frame kit)
Learn More: raawmtb.com
The frame kit (frame, Fox DPX2 Factory shock, headset, axle and frame protection) is available for €2690, with the option of having a Fox Float X2 or DHX2 shock for a €150 surcharge. Now, two complete bikes are also available, both are built using a 170mm Fox 36 GRIP2 fork, DPX2 Factory shock, Stans Flow rims and Maxxis tires. €4990 for the 'Factory build' and €6490 'XTR build.' These prices include German VAT at 19%, so purchases from outside the EU will be reduced, but local taxes will apply. Currently, the Madonna can be shipped worldwide, with the exception of the USA and Canada (this should be an option in the very near-future).
 | Overall the Raaw is an awesome machine that really can do it all. |
Construction and Features
![Raw Madonna Bike Test]()
![Raw Madonna Bike Test]()
![Raw Madonna Bike Test]()
To some, this might 'only' be an expensive aluminum frame, but it is a very well thought out piece of design, with more features than you can shake an aluminum tube at. Rather than solely thinking about performance and weight on paper, Raaw were aiming for durability and functionality as well.
These durability goals are obvious when taking a look at the bearings and pivot hardware that RAAW chose. Large 52mm bearings are used at the main pivot, which is the same size that is used in the lower cup of a tapered headset. For the rest of the pivot bearings, 28mm bearings are used, including at the upper shock mount, in order to reduce friction (this also means one spare could fit any pivot). In addition, with the exception of the main pivot, all other hardware only requires a 5mm hex key to work on. These decisions are something that aggressive, high mileage riders who slap a lot of turns will approve of, as changing bearings every month or two soon becomes wearing.
Integrated storage was something else Raaw were aiming for, similar to Specialized's SWAT system, to make it easier to carry everything you need without a bag. There is space for a bottle cage and full-size water bottle, along with a recess in the down tube for shock clearance and spare tube storage, with a strap also provided. Due to the way the top tube is constructed using two separate aluminum tubes, there is also a hidden pocket in the top tube and specially made pouch with press-stud for easy access. This is big enough to hold cash, keys, spare chain links, zip ties, and CO2 inflator.
Other details are the hollow forged frame parts, which reduce weight without leaving external pockets for mud to gather. A threaded bottom bracket, external cable routing and differently sized brake mounts that do away with adapters.
![Raw Madonna Bike Test]()
![Raw Madonna Bike Test]()
The hidden pouch uses a press-stud fixing and is useful for storing small essentials.
The lower part of the downtube provides some more storage for small tools or spares, there are metal loops that use the supplied velcro strap to hold them in place.
The Trunnion-mounted shock runs on bearings, rather than bushings, for a smoother action.
To some, this might 'only' be an expensive aluminum frame, but it is a very well thought out piece of design, with more features than you can shake an aluminum tube at. Rather than solely thinking about performance and weight on paper, Raaw were aiming for durability and functionality as well.
These durability goals are obvious when taking a look at the bearings and pivot hardware that RAAW chose. Large 52mm bearings are used at the main pivot, which is the same size that is used in the lower cup of a tapered headset. For the rest of the pivot bearings, 28mm bearings are used, including at the upper shock mount, in order to reduce friction (this also means one spare could fit any pivot). In addition, with the exception of the main pivot, all other hardware only requires a 5mm hex key to work on. These decisions are something that aggressive, high mileage riders who slap a lot of turns will approve of, as changing bearings every month or two soon becomes wearing.
Integrated storage was something else Raaw were aiming for, similar to Specialized's SWAT system, to make it easier to carry everything you need without a bag. There is space for a bottle cage and full-size water bottle, along with a recess in the down tube for shock clearance and spare tube storage, with a strap also provided. Due to the way the top tube is constructed using two separate aluminum tubes, there is also a hidden pocket in the top tube and specially made pouch with press-stud for easy access. This is big enough to hold cash, keys, spare chain links, zip ties, and CO2 inflator.
Other details are the hollow forged frame parts, which reduce weight without leaving external pockets for mud to gather. A threaded bottom bracket, external cable routing and differently sized brake mounts that do away with adapters.
External cable routing and a smart way to carry a spare hanger (I claim full credit for this ingenuity and it saved me on the last ride).
Those huge main bearings and pivot could probably be used for further storage, jelly babies maybe?
Geometry & Sizing
![photo]()
The Madonna is only available in sizes medium, large and XL, which is probably sensible considering the amount of travel on tap and the big wheels could potentially cause problems for shorter riders.
The geometry is certainly modern, but also balanced. On a standard XL bike with 160mm fork, there is 500mm of reach, a 65° head angle, 35mm bottom bracket drop, 78.2° seat tube angle and 450 mm chainstay, adding up to a 1291mm wheelbase. Unlike most brands, Raaw opted for proportional length chainstays, with the medium using 440mm chainstays, the large 445mm chainstays and the 450mm chain stays on the XL. This should keep the front to rear wheel weight balance more consistent between the sizes.
With the 180mm travel Lyrik fork, the axle to crown height is 24mm longer than the 160mm travel Fox 36 it was designed around; these numbers change slightly to the ones on the geometry chart above. The reach reduces to 489 mm, head angle slackens to 64°, bottom bracket rises to -25mm drop, the seat tube slackens to 77.2° and the wheelbase adds up to 1297 mm.
The Madonna is only available in sizes medium, large and XL, which is probably sensible considering the amount of travel on tap and the big wheels could potentially cause problems for shorter riders.
The geometry is certainly modern, but also balanced. On a standard XL bike with 160mm fork, there is 500mm of reach, a 65° head angle, 35mm bottom bracket drop, 78.2° seat tube angle and 450 mm chainstay, adding up to a 1291mm wheelbase. Unlike most brands, Raaw opted for proportional length chainstays, with the medium using 440mm chainstays, the large 445mm chainstays and the 450mm chain stays on the XL. This should keep the front to rear wheel weight balance more consistent between the sizes.
With the 180mm travel Lyrik fork, the axle to crown height is 24mm longer than the 160mm travel Fox 36 it was designed around; these numbers change slightly to the ones on the geometry chart above. The reach reduces to 489 mm, head angle slackens to 64°, bottom bracket rises to -25mm drop, the seat tube slackens to 77.2° and the wheelbase adds up to 1297 mm.
Suspension Design
The four-bar linkage suspension layout features a huge rocker link, delivering a consistently growing leverage ratio that ends at just over 20% of progression. This progression leads to great support and uses the 160mm of travel efficiently. The main pivot is designed around a one-by drivetrain, delivering superb pedaling efficiency, even when sprinting.
A high starting leverage ratio combined with ball bearings on the shock pivots makes the suspension supple from the start which promises to track the ground and create grip. The influence of braking on the suspension is designed to be very active at the beginning of the travel, allowing impacts to be absorbed while braking. Deeper in the travel the influence of braking increases and gives the rider slightly more stable geometry when things get rowdy.
Soon there will be a rocker-link for riders over 90-95 kg. The geo of this rocker link has been tweaked to use 65mm of stroke instead of 60mm to get 160mm of travel. This lowers the leverage ratio, which reduces the air pressure or spring rate needed and puts less force on the damping. This will be available in March as an upgrade for €200 and sometime next year as an option when purchasing a frame.
![photo]()
![photo]()
![photo]()
![photo]()
The four-bar linkage suspension layout features a huge rocker link, delivering a consistently growing leverage ratio that ends at just over 20% of progression. This progression leads to great support and uses the 160mm of travel efficiently. The main pivot is designed around a one-by drivetrain, delivering superb pedaling efficiency, even when sprinting.
A high starting leverage ratio combined with ball bearings on the shock pivots makes the suspension supple from the start which promises to track the ground and create grip. The influence of braking on the suspension is designed to be very active at the beginning of the travel, allowing impacts to be absorbed while braking. Deeper in the travel the influence of braking increases and gives the rider slightly more stable geometry when things get rowdy.
Soon there will be a rocker-link for riders over 90-95 kg. The geo of this rocker link has been tweaked to use 65mm of stroke instead of 60mm to get 160mm of travel. This lowers the leverage ratio, which reduces the air pressure or spring rate needed and puts less force on the damping. This will be available in March as an upgrade for €200 and sometime next year as an option when purchasing a frame.
Specifications
![Raw Madonna Bike Test]()
![Raw Madonna Bike Test]()
As already mentioned, this bike was custom built for the review as no complete bikes were available at the time. SRAM provided the majority of the parts, with a 180mm travel Lyrik RC2 42mm offset fork, and longer stroke Super Deluxe RT with a TwistLoc remote lockout shock providing 12mm more travel than standard at 172 mm. There is also a SRAM GX Eagle drivetrain, Code RSC brakes with 200/180mm rotors, a Truvativ cockpit, a 170mm Reverb dropper post, Newmen E30 wheels, and I mostly used Schwalbe's Eddy Current eMTB tires front and rear.
![Raw Madonna Bike Test]()
The Raaw featured a SRAM-heavy build, with the 35mm Descendant bar and stem leading the charge.
Relatively cheap and cheerful, the GX crankset took a beating without blinking and the carbon-backed Mozarrt chainguide didn't drop a single chain.
As already mentioned, this bike was custom built for the review as no complete bikes were available at the time. SRAM provided the majority of the parts, with a 180mm travel Lyrik RC2 42mm offset fork, and longer stroke Super Deluxe RT with a TwistLoc remote lockout shock providing 12mm more travel than standard at 172 mm. There is also a SRAM GX Eagle drivetrain, Code RSC brakes with 200/180mm rotors, a Truvativ cockpit, a 170mm Reverb dropper post, Newmen E30 wheels, and I mostly used Schwalbe's Eddy Current eMTB tires front and rear.
| Specifications | ||
| Price | ||
| Travel | 172mm | |
| Rear Shock | Rockshox Super Deluxe Coil RT, remote 400lb spring 65mm stroke | |
| Fork | Rockshox Lyrik RC2 29" 180mm, 42mm offset | |
| Headset | Acros | |
| Cassette | SRAM Eagle GX | |
| Crankarms | SRAM GX 170mm 34t chainring | |
| Chainguide | Mozarrt | |
| Bottom Bracket | SRAM GXP | |
| Pedals | One UP | |
| Rear Derailleur | SRAM Eagle GX | |
| Chain | SRAM Eagle X01 | |
| Shifter Pods | SRAM Eagle GX | |
| Handlebar | Truvativ Descendant Aluminium 35mm, 25mm rise, 800mm width | |
| Stem | Truvativ Descendant 35mm, 40mm length | |
| Grips | Renthal Push on | |
| Brakes | SRAM Code RSC 200/180mm rotors | |
| Wheelset | Newmen E30 Boost, XD driver | |
| Tires | Schwalbe Eddy Current front | |
| Seat | SQ Lab | |
| Seatpost | Rockshox Reverb 170mm 1X lever | |
Test Bike Setup
After building the Madonna, it was probably one of the easiest bikes to set up thanks to the RockShox suspension. No tokens, 90psi, with minimal high and low-speed compression for comfortable arms on the long and rough trails I frequent. I used a 400 lb/in spring on the Super Deluxe coil and the only thing to do was set the rebound.
The Madonna has been my go-to pedal bike since last August and has had a whole load of abuse thrown at it, mostly around Finale Ligure including taking on the 52km EWS round last October. It was also abused by the 100kg, 'World's Fastest Albanian,' Genc Marku, at a few local races and battered for a few days guiding to try and finish it off – it took everything in its stride and is still fully functional.
After building the Madonna, it was probably one of the easiest bikes to set up thanks to the RockShox suspension. No tokens, 90psi, with minimal high and low-speed compression for comfortable arms on the long and rough trails I frequent. I used a 400 lb/in spring on the Super Deluxe coil and the only thing to do was set the rebound.
The Madonna has been my go-to pedal bike since last August and has had a whole load of abuse thrown at it, mostly around Finale Ligure including taking on the 52km EWS round last October. It was also abused by the 100kg, 'World's Fastest Albanian,' Genc Marku, at a few local races and battered for a few days guiding to try and finish it off – it took everything in its stride and is still fully functional.
Paul Aston
Location: Finale Ligure, Italy
Age: 33
Height: 6'1"
Weight: 75kg
Industry affiliations / sponsors: None
Instagram: @astonator
Location: Finale Ligure, Italy
Age: 33
Height: 6'1"
Weight: 75kg
Industry affiliations / sponsors: None
Instagram: @astonator
Weight: I'm expecting many Pinkbiker's to read the weight figures in the details box at the start of this article and go straight to the comments to moan about the 37 lb weight of this bike, saying that 'X-bike weighs 27lbs and can be raced blah blah blah.' But this needs to be put into context. First, this machine has been hammered for months and has not missed a single beat, and it survived a brutal EWS race where I passed rider after rider with mechanicals issues. I do not believe there are many racers that finish one of these events with a complete, race ready bike that weighs less than 33lbs, but am happy to be proven wrong. The weight includes all alloy parts, 29" x 2.5" DH casing Maxxis Minion tires, a coil shock with a lockout, chainguide, mid-range GX Eagle, 170mm dropper post and the OneUp tool. The frame weight of 3.8kg is around a kilo more than a Scott Ransom for example, so if you wanted to, you could get this bike down around the 30 lb mark. I prefer to pedal a few extra pounds and not carry the bike down the trail.
Climbing
The Raaw climbs extremely well for a bike in this category, and flies from the start. I think this bike is more proof that the riders position in relation to the bottom bracket can be more important than the suspension design itself for pedaling efficiency. I measured an actual seat angle of 76º at my preferred saddle height of 74cm from the BB center, this makes it one of the steepest on the market without getting confused about different manufacturers' measurements. Despite people saying my knees will explode, they, along with my lower back and hips never felt better - even riding back along the beachfront after completing the 52km EWS race in Finale I was upright and comfortable.
Standing up and putting down the power, the Raaw still kept pushing forward with little lag despite the long travel and 'scary' numbers on the weight scale. It also provided great uphill traction, with its only climbing downside being the low bottom bracket that makes pedal strikes more frequent. This is less of a problem when you're fresh, accurate, and on top of your game, but it did cause me a few problems when my eyes and heart rate were in the red when racing - I completely messed up two climbs by striking pedals and losing all momentum and a lot of time at the EWS. I would really look for something shorter than the 170mm cranks I chose to improve ground clearance on technical climbs.
The Twistloc remote did help with this by increasing the ride height, firming things up, but still giving good small bump compliance and grip. This is easily the best lockout system on the market and improved the climbing of the Raaw even further. Firming the suspension up by twisting the grip is easy at the bottom of the climbs, but can be slightly more difficult if you press the PopLoc button when already committed to a descent and holding on for dear-life – you need to release your grip slightly to let it rotate back to the open position but this becomes natural quickly.
![Raw Madonna Bike Test]()
Descending
There's barely anything that got in the way of the Raaw on the way back down the hill. Big wheels and lots of travel meant it could take on everything with ease and I would be happy to take this bike to many full-on downhill tracks. The coil sprung suspension was superbly supple off the top, giving great traction and a smooth ride. The rear suspension had support in all the right places and plenty in reserve for the biggest of hits.
The low bottom bracket gave a secure feeling and placed me in the bike, rather than on top of it. This also helps to carve corners but being so low does slow down the switch between directions somewhat. The downside of a steep seat angle, which becomes clear after riding downhill bikes with more relaxed or set-back saddles, is that the seat is getting in the way between your thighs more - the longer 170mm Reverb helped to get it out of the way, but I wouldn't say no to 200mm of drop.
Overall, the Raaw is an awesome machine that really can do it all. If I was nitpicking I would raise the bottom bracket slightly. I proved this was my preference by running a 500lb spring to raise the dynamic ride height, giving more breathing space when descending and climbing through rock sections, and sped up changes of direction; the Raaw has plenty of stability so raising the bike a little shouldn't have any negative effects.
The Raaw climbs extremely well for a bike in this category, and flies from the start. I think this bike is more proof that the riders position in relation to the bottom bracket can be more important than the suspension design itself for pedaling efficiency. I measured an actual seat angle of 76º at my preferred saddle height of 74cm from the BB center, this makes it one of the steepest on the market without getting confused about different manufacturers' measurements. Despite people saying my knees will explode, they, along with my lower back and hips never felt better - even riding back along the beachfront after completing the 52km EWS race in Finale I was upright and comfortable.
Standing up and putting down the power, the Raaw still kept pushing forward with little lag despite the long travel and 'scary' numbers on the weight scale. It also provided great uphill traction, with its only climbing downside being the low bottom bracket that makes pedal strikes more frequent. This is less of a problem when you're fresh, accurate, and on top of your game, but it did cause me a few problems when my eyes and heart rate were in the red when racing - I completely messed up two climbs by striking pedals and losing all momentum and a lot of time at the EWS. I would really look for something shorter than the 170mm cranks I chose to improve ground clearance on technical climbs.
The Twistloc remote did help with this by increasing the ride height, firming things up, but still giving good small bump compliance and grip. This is easily the best lockout system on the market and improved the climbing of the Raaw even further. Firming the suspension up by twisting the grip is easy at the bottom of the climbs, but can be slightly more difficult if you press the PopLoc button when already committed to a descent and holding on for dear-life – you need to release your grip slightly to let it rotate back to the open position but this becomes natural quickly.
Descending
There's barely anything that got in the way of the Raaw on the way back down the hill. Big wheels and lots of travel meant it could take on everything with ease and I would be happy to take this bike to many full-on downhill tracks. The coil sprung suspension was superbly supple off the top, giving great traction and a smooth ride. The rear suspension had support in all the right places and plenty in reserve for the biggest of hits.
The low bottom bracket gave a secure feeling and placed me in the bike, rather than on top of it. This also helps to carve corners but being so low does slow down the switch between directions somewhat. The downside of a steep seat angle, which becomes clear after riding downhill bikes with more relaxed or set-back saddles, is that the seat is getting in the way between your thighs more - the longer 170mm Reverb helped to get it out of the way, but I wouldn't say no to 200mm of drop.
Overall, the Raaw is an awesome machine that really can do it all. If I was nitpicking I would raise the bottom bracket slightly. I proved this was my preference by running a 500lb spring to raise the dynamic ride height, giving more breathing space when descending and climbing through rock sections, and sped up changes of direction; the Raaw has plenty of stability so raising the bike a little shouldn't have any negative effects.
How does it compare?
I didn't do a full review of the new Canyon Strive but it is the most similar bike I have ridden in recent times. Geometry-wise, I think the Raaw is ahead for its intended purpose with a slacker head and much steeper seat tube angle, and size-adjusted chainstay, rather than a one-size fits all solution. Canyon's Shapeshifter is a great concept, but the Raaw shows that geometry and a simple lock-out system can give you a better descending and climbing shape. The mighty Canyon brand offers much better value, though, than the one-man band behind Raaw.
I didn't do a full review of the new Canyon Strive but it is the most similar bike I have ridden in recent times. Geometry-wise, I think the Raaw is ahead for its intended purpose with a slacker head and much steeper seat tube angle, and size-adjusted chainstay, rather than a one-size fits all solution. Canyon's Shapeshifter is a great concept, but the Raaw shows that geometry and a simple lock-out system can give you a better descending and climbing shape. The mighty Canyon brand offers much better value, though, than the one-man band behind Raaw.
Technical Report
Storage: It was really useful having the little storage pockets on the bike, the OneUp EDC, and a bottle cage mount. I really like having everything on the bike, so that you can grab it from the shedand just get straight on the trail without checking that you have everything you need in a pack.
OneUp EDC: This tool stored away in the steerer tube was used many times, and it's quick and easy to use for small adjustments and repairs. Threading the steerer tube seems like a faff, but once done it does away with those silly star-nuts for good. If I had a collection of my own bikes, I would thread the steerer on each one and use the lockring headset cap (includes stem spacer and the lower steerer bung) which costs €20, then the tool can easily be transferred between bikes in seconds.
Double-sealed bearings: Even after months of use, racing, washing, riding in bad conditions, I popped off the double-sealed bearing caps to be presented by completely clean and smooth running bearings.
TwistLoc remote: The TwistLoc remote performed well and was easy to install. It should be run with SRAM's matching grips, or you end up with a small ridge if you use different diameter grips, as I found with my preferred Renthal Push-Ons.
I did lose the rubber cap on the shifter but replaced it with tape, and there is always a slight movement in the grip-shifter that cannot be stopped. This is slightly annoying but not noticeable on the trail – similar to how Centerlock rotors annoy people in the car park but you never feel that rocking when riding.
![Raw Madonna Bike Test]()
GX Eagle: I'll never be convinced that hanging a derailleur off the back of a bike is the final solution for the type of (careless and often imprecise) riding I do, but, in this drivetrain's defense, it performed smoothly throughout the duration of the test. Months and months of riding only resulted in a few tweaks being made to the cable tension and limit adjusters.
RockShox Suspension: The Super Deluxe and Lyrik also performed without issue. There may be dampers that can give you marginally better performance, but these units are the best set-and-forget on the market. Despite the limited adjustment, they do everything that nearly anybody could want with no fuss and great reliability – perfect for riders who want to shred more than tweak dials.
![Raw Madonna Bike Test]()
Storage: It was really useful having the little storage pockets on the bike, the OneUp EDC, and a bottle cage mount. I really like having everything on the bike, so that you can grab it from the shedand just get straight on the trail without checking that you have everything you need in a pack.
OneUp EDC: This tool stored away in the steerer tube was used many times, and it's quick and easy to use for small adjustments and repairs. Threading the steerer tube seems like a faff, but once done it does away with those silly star-nuts for good. If I had a collection of my own bikes, I would thread the steerer on each one and use the lockring headset cap (includes stem spacer and the lower steerer bung) which costs €20, then the tool can easily be transferred between bikes in seconds.
Double-sealed bearings: Even after months of use, racing, washing, riding in bad conditions, I popped off the double-sealed bearing caps to be presented by completely clean and smooth running bearings.
TwistLoc remote: The TwistLoc remote performed well and was easy to install. It should be run with SRAM's matching grips, or you end up with a small ridge if you use different diameter grips, as I found with my preferred Renthal Push-Ons.
I did lose the rubber cap on the shifter but replaced it with tape, and there is always a slight movement in the grip-shifter that cannot be stopped. This is slightly annoying but not noticeable on the trail – similar to how Centerlock rotors annoy people in the car park but you never feel that rocking when riding.
GX Eagle: I'll never be convinced that hanging a derailleur off the back of a bike is the final solution for the type of (careless and often imprecise) riding I do, but, in this drivetrain's defense, it performed smoothly throughout the duration of the test. Months and months of riding only resulted in a few tweaks being made to the cable tension and limit adjusters.
RockShox Suspension: The Super Deluxe and Lyrik also performed without issue. There may be dampers that can give you marginally better performance, but these units are the best set-and-forget on the market. Despite the limited adjustment, they do everything that nearly anybody could want with no fuss and great reliability – perfect for riders who want to shred more than tweak dials.
SQ Lab 60X saddle: This saddle is actually marketed as an eMTB saddle but works fine on a pedal bike. The three levels can be used for different seated positions and they stop you sliding back on steep climbs. There is also nothing I have found that matches the comfort of these saddles when you have correctly measured your bum-bones and chosen the correct size – I wouldn't choose anything else.
Newmen A.30 wheels: I'm not going to say that these are 'unbreakable', but bloody hell, we did our best and they survived it all while other wheels from big players were falling apart by the day.
Newmen A.30 wheels: I'm not going to say that these are 'unbreakable', but bloody hell, we did our best and they survived it all while other wheels from big players were falling apart by the day.
Pros
+ Fantastic all-around weapon
+ Integrated storage and bottle mounts
+ Solid and durable build
Cons
- Low bottom bracket
- Expensive frame price
Is this the bike for you?
If you are looking for a great all-rounder and don't want to look like everybody else at the trailhead on their generic machines, the Madonna could be for you. It's a fantastic pedaler and descender, with attention to details that many of the big brands fail to deliver.
If you are looking for a great all-rounder and don't want to look like everybody else at the trailhead on their generic machines, the Madonna could be for you. It's a fantastic pedaler and descender, with attention to details that many of the big brands fail to deliver.
Pinkbike's Take
| The Madonna is a solid speed weapon that will fly you up and down mountains with ease, smash through the roughest terrain and put up with neglect. It's a great option for people that care more about getting on with riding and trail performance than double-checking grams on a spreadsheet. |
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Really ? A 170 29er monster flying on uphill ?
What is a carbon cross country bike then ? A space rocket ?
Common sense has been lost for ever in MTB.
My 15,3kg alumimum, Capra 29 with 170mm and DHR2 Exo climbs really well, too. Did 6600hm in Finale 2 weeks ago, uphill. And on none of the trails I would have wanted a carbon CC bike for the downs.
I wonder why that top tube is so short. With that steep seat angle, the XL should deserve a longer reach, say 530mm. The seat tube could be 490 or so also.
XL frames should not fit folks that are a mere 185cm, but 195cm. Otherwise I would call it a "L".
No guys, No Paul Aston, the reference is not a mid trail full sus bike for reference (like a Spectral).
As a top reference, the best climber is a 8/9 kg lightwheight XC bike. And the worst a 170 29er weighing more than the empire state building.
PS : don't get me wrong, I have a Meta V4.2 with heavy coil weighing a ton. It "climbs" for sure, but it's a tank.
What's the point overwise ?
Body weight and the vehicle weight have a quite a different effect imo.I know this beyond any doubt: I can feel losing 2# on my bike easily but can't tell on my body at all.
Put DH tires on a 9kg bike and it will feel worse than a 16kg bike with XC tires.
And the analogy for the 500lbs woman doesnt make sense as she doesnt lift at all. You´ll notice 5kg difference in bodyweight- trust me, especially if youre somewhat fit.
Thank you @paulaston Paul Aston for measuring the actual angle, though you should clarify, I believe you measured the actual seat tube angle - not the seat angle...
Ps, you may not have mentioned XC specifically, but it's assumed given you replied to a thread where everyone is comparing this to an XC bike due to a comment Paul made.
Really why not add some lead to your frame then? I don't think so!
HA: 67º
STA: 76º
CS: 450mm
Reach: 500mm
WB: ~1200mm
I'd run a 50mm stem with drop bars, disc brakes a 50T chainring with a 10-42T mtbike cassette so I could run only a rear deraileur and a dropper post so as to enhance cornering performance on fast downhills.
gizmodo.com/100-years-of-tour-de-france-bikes-map-the-evolution-of-709973821
Also curious to your view of BMX bike geometry?
Have only ridden roadbikes and I love the low weight and lack of drag from the hubs. Handling is utter shit, sizing is terrible (compensation with long stem) and at the time I road with rim brakes which was scary compared to my Shimano Saint MTB.
BMX race in my opinion needs longer bikes, especially in reach and a slightly slacker headangle. For street and vert the geo is fine because you are looking for something super small and agile to throw around. I do, however, find it strange stronger tires aren't used instead of singleply tires with 100psi in them...
PS: Great link! Fascinating stuff!
As someone that rides a newschool fat tire road bike, your geometry makes no sense even for the far extremes of what "road" constitutes.
It seems illogical that a bike built to ride fast on wide roads should have a wheelbase of around 1000mm and a near vertical head angle with short chainstays, The fact the taller riders are forced to ride bikes with slacker seat angles and longer stems so that the wheelbase does not grow very much compared to a shorter guys bike is just insane!
But hey if you enjoy your road bike more power to you. I like to have bikes that handle well instead of having to compensate and ride around terrible geometry.
There are plenty of bikes out there that don't conform to norms, fashion, or to UCI regulations. Specialized made a "F-UCI" bike a few years ago, as an example. People are able to go nuts on geometry, but they haven't ended up with that geometry because it'd handled absolutely stupidly slowly and honestly take all the fun agility out of a road bike.
What you see as "terrible geometry" is stuff that's been experimented and toyed with for well over double your lifespan. People run that geo, frankly, because that's what is fun and that is what works best.
But hey, you clearly know better than everyone else, Mr. Pinkbike Commenter.
I can understand why you think my views are like that though. I've seen the change in geometry in MTBiking from the 90s XC hardtail (pretty roadlike) to the bikes of today and I truely believe the UCI restrictions has stifled the further evolution of the roadbike geo. Now within the restrictions of the UCI roadbikes have been taken to the max. We see that with aero, shifting, materials, etc.
But like I said if you like your current bike great, it doesn't work for me though and I'll wait until the UCI lifts the ban to see how things pan out or barring that I'll put some cash together and make my own.
Keep the word "UCI" out of your posts. It's a buzzword, and completely irrelevant to what we're talking about.
Yeah, those silly star nuts that have worked perfectly well on nearly every mountain bike on the planet for the best part of two decades.
I also have a Woodman one that is aluminium and a little more refined. Azonic used to make them as well.
I think BMX guys use them too.
I think the bike looks awesome, but lets not kid ourselves, this is DH bike which you can pedal uphill.
Did he really move to Birmingham from Finale? Man that´s tough.
On the other hand, if the weld can handle the strain it might give some nice compliance in the frame.
It's my big bike though, and I want it to be tough, and last. You do notice the weight, but it climbs well for it's size
The tool slot is neat too.
That’s what I ride currently. Geo feels great, I just feel like it runs out of travel pretty easy. Spec may be on the lower end, but it performs great. The grip fork is better than the 2018 f36 rc2 imo.
Given the quite steep STA resulting in the ETT in a size L department for most of bikes out there, would you actually upsize if it were possible?
Regarding the saddle, how does it compare to Specialized Power or Selle SMP offerings?
Under 14Kg I don´t even believe the machine can take the abuse so then it somehow slow me down. Also with that weight I believe it goes much calmer when pointed thru rockgardens and roots.
What is not so good for me is once you find interesting frame talking about geometry, you are pushed to go 29" nowadays which sucks for me
It helps that I'm the same height and have the same trail preferences!
the bike should perform for an entire season (manufacture service interval) without issues - that service, then again;
The BB is slightly higher in the "low" position, but I smash into rocks and roots regularly on climbs with 175mm cranks.
The suspension seems to be a bit different, though - looking at those graphs. The Capra needs to be pushed with force to activate the suspension, but on the occasional huck to flat uses 90% of travel.
Like raw but longer ?
Or more like car but longer ?
Within this context, it makes complete sense. Would you compare an XC bike with a 4.5kg road bike?
Pipe pipe
hast stash
joint joint
crack cut
I’d be far more upset with the usage of an e-bike tyre on the front.
NN is fine front or rear, great trail tyre.
But I would never think that Paul Aston would use it in Finale Ligure!
Seems many here ( nothing unusual for Pinkbike) hammer away at keyboards before even bothering and to read the specification list.
And how about you keyboard engineers? The frame would comply at least with ISO 4210 or can’t be listed for sale.
Sometimes the mediocrity of thought and comments here beggars belief
- No Engineer Ever
If the FEA shows a better frame than the carbon version then yes, use the aluminum.
Notice at all how carbon frames got chunkier after 2017?
It's because the FEA on those frames pointed out that their aluminum counterparts were stronger and stiffer.
Literally no reason for anyone to be ignorant ever.
I'd say that is a pretty big con for the consumer and the company, seeing as that's a consumer base of almost a half billion affluent customers.
I wish Ruben all the best but he should think about bikes ascetics if he wants to sell it anywhere else other than the Reich.
How can you have an idea if ANY of the bikes you have listed are going to ride better? The reviews of the RAAW floating around all have one thing in common, which is how well engineered they are, and how well they ride, compared to pretty much anything on the market.
It's clearly right up there as one of the very best 29" enduro race bikes on the market.
Have fun spending 2k+ on a bike built by people that get paid $1 a day or something like that.