@juanpkumicho: cheers. Realise my comment seemed bad but I'm just anxious for the news, he's been on the pace this season and to see this is really sad. Hope he heals up and gets back on form asap, heal up remi
Lol , I gotta ask, what is a track for 29" wheels ? What a freaking joke uh ?Remember the days where a DH bicycle what suitable for any REAL DH tracks? Tracks are so freakin gay now and if 29er were really faster on a track designed specifically for them its would still be freakin marginal and not worth the trouble for one bit #enduroismoredhthandh #gimmerealnewtechnology #enoughwiththef*ckingbullshit
@dubod22: and he's on 27.5. If 29ers roll faster than 27.5 then gwin is that much better, confirmed a machine. If it turns out that 29ers are much faster and next season everyone are on 29ers they will have to keep gwin on 650b to keep the playing field level. Insane
@jclnv: did you watch Lourdes? Cause that's a horrible comparison. None of the top 15 riders did well, that weather moved in causing the best riders to crash. The results were upside down.
@jclnv: Yeah you're right jclnv, he didn't do too well at Lourdes. No one did that raced in the rain. Pretty sure he killed it last year on his first race on YT. Love the PB crowd that can't be part of the fun but always part of the bullshit. Must be a shit existence.
@Lotusoperandi: Yes! Why risk the final outcome or potential injury /crash when it's only qualies.. Especially as a seasoned vet like Minnaar! He is not absolutely pinned and putting it all on the line during this compared to actual race runs..
@leftCoastBurn: Yep! Why put it all on the line when it's only qualifier and risk crash or injury as a seasoned vet like Minnaar! You get a bit older you got to apply methods a bit differently... So I stand by my previous comment. (cracks beer)!
@bohns1: I have to agree a bit. Based on Gwins own words, he can finally take a breath after the race run. Not that anyone holds back during qualifying, but I think they're all running at 95% up until the race. Before that they have to preserve themselves for the race and only go full on for one run. Pretty amazing that at the top of an amazingly talented field there is still so much variety with success. Gwin hasn't won in 9 months. Hart killed it to end the season but hasn't resumed where he left off. Minnaar has tons of critics because of his age but still has the potential to win another title. Then there's 10 other guys who are legit threats every race. This is the best sport on the planet!!! PS. Loris Vergier is the man. Love that kid.
Trek/Syndicate say 29ers are 1-2 seconds faster over 1 minute of track... So on a track that is 'basically a f*cking path' made for 29ers, Gwins time is therefore theoretically at least 5 seconds quicker than the 'GOAT' on his 27.5...
@jclnv: I was only referencing the he said she said comments about bike park tracks, 29ers etc. To me I don't think 29ers have affected recent results that significantly. Sure Minaar looks more comfortable on a a 29er and I think thats what it comes down to imo.
@bstructure: I thought the idea was mainly that 29ers would smooth a track out more, making it easier to ride fast on rough tracks and carry speed. That would lead to closer racing on this track because it's so smooth, but a theoretical 29er advantage on rougher tracks as they make them "easier".
Bruni was citing this as his main concern; that the tracks are getting easier and that the bikes compounding that. So he wants ether small wheels and the current tracks, or 29" and harder/rougher/steeper tracks. That being said, he's very keen on suspension testing...
I totally agree that it doesn't seem to be making a difference to results though, just making the taller riders more comfortable. I suppose we will end up with two category's for DH bikes; 27.5 Race/Park and a 29 Race specific or for taller riders.
@euan91m: I agree with your take on it, just pointing out the many contradictory arguments over wheel sizes etc. I can remember a vid a few years back with Minaar and his mechanic trying something like a 0.5 degree alteration in bar sweep and was in Minaars eyes a significant change. The 'feel' of a bike is more important than its numbers.
On a rough, straight blown out fireroad the 29er might be faster
On really rough tracks with tight twists and turns drops, g-outs - think val di sole - I see an advantage for smaller wheels because its easier to do body enlglish on them...
@jclnv is right on this one. The physics is basic enough that I might actually not screw this up.
For a fixed, equally distributed mass, larger diameter wheels have a larger moment of Inertia. If you started a large and a small wheel rolling at the top of a hill, the small one would reach the bottom of the hill first.
If the track were perfectly smooth, you'd rather be running 26ers.
The advantage of a big wheel is that it has greater rotational inertia. This means that rough stuff tends to slow it down less than an otherwise equivalent, smaller diameter wheel.
@jclnv: actually you are the one who is wrong. 29 is only faster on "relatively" rough tracks -- lots of small/med bumps in small succession. However there is a point of diminishing return for wheelsize where more travel would actually be much more beneficial than larger wheels -- think massive jumps, bombholes, huge rocks, drops and whoops top to bottom. Unfortunately the modern DH tracks are nothing like this so bike tech is going totally in the wrong direction. Think of why MX bikes settled for smaller wheels and 12 inches of travel -- look at the hits those bikes take at insane speed -- it makes MTB look like a joke
@WaterBear: Yeah I'm not disagreeing with you, so lets continue some more basic physics lol.
Many people say 27.5 accelerates out of corners faster and 29ers are harder to get up to speed initially. Physics would back this up but would also say that a 29 inch wheel would have a higher top speed compared to 27.5. It doesn't equate to the real world so much though in my eyes...
@WaterBear: If the part of your explanation about "if the track were perfectly smooth, you'd rather be running 26ers" is true to any degree at all then 20" BMX bikes would be significantly faster on smooth terrain which they're not.
Early days but I don't think your wrong.He's one of the most dynamic/reactive riders out there and in the recent clips and bits I've seen of him - seems to now be muted somewhat and struggling in the corners as the bike seems to be wanting to stand him up.......I still think the tallest guys will thrive whilst the shorter ones may just try to survive on 29ers. Speed is nothing without control.
I personally don't see the problem with 1 track not being super technical. I mean yea I love watching the tech stuff but a smoother fast track focuses on different strengths and abilities, gives the circuit a more rounded feel. Just my opinion.
There is a spectrum at one end bmx track which suites 20inch wheels at the other fort William which suite 29. Leogang sits somewhere between the extremes. I don't think there is a disadvantage to 29ers here but gwin kicks ass on this track every year.
@leopaul: On the final jump. Guess he got past the finish line in the same manner Ondrej Bank did when he crashed on the last jump in Beaver Creek (downhill skiing).
@davehuffstetler: no thats a too "small" crash to be what we're talking about.. and you cant make the mistake by thinking this is Thirion... Remi did certainly jump the thing..
So did the rider complaints about the course being too rough last year come before everyone knew they would be on 29s? Cuz it seems like the complaints this year of "too smooth" are directed at the lack of advantage of the 29. Can't wait for the results.
@mecagoenvuestrosmuertos: Why do people always blame the industry? Would you rather all bike companies went out of business than try to make a profit so they can continue producing bikes?
@metaam: some people would, then they could finally ride their newest flashiest 6k$+ intense 27,5 all carbon with modern geometry without the afterthought of a better bike coming the next year and being butthurt about it.
I like the progress, even if it's incremental and sometimes bs comes out (like boost), but it's undeniable how bikes now are better at a set price than a few years ago
Minnaar the oldest of all of them and still the top contender. Just goes to show the mental strength he has over risk, especially when comparing to the young guns. I guess that's why he's the greatest rider ever.
29er /27.5 choice makes less difference on a smoother track. The main advantage of 29er is the angle of attack which smooths bumps. As everyone has been saying there are no bumps.
Yeah but the big wheels "carry momentum," "have more traction," and are better in every way other than tight corners........(as is the mantra) this track should be the showcase for 29ers.
To be fair Minaar did say they were simply "faster everywhere".. But Gwin has won here twice in a row, it obviously suits him, that maybe counts for more than wheel size.
@Lotusoperandi: I've got a comment up top a bit that explains the effect of 29ers. There's really only 3 things a larger diameter wheel does. Increased moment of inertia (making them accelerate more slowly), increased rotational inertia (making them harder to decelerate), and a slightly increased effective gearing.
That last point doesn't seem important, so you have the first two to think about.
@WaterBear: s 29" wheel does way more than that. the increased gyroscopic force makes the bike more stable, the larger contact patch giving more grip, the lower BB to axle gives a greater ballast effect....The rider can push harder against these forces in corners and so on. Probably more stuff i missed....multiple paradigm shifts that change the sum
Gwin couldn't help himself once again! He's just so fast. And he proves that it really not a game of wheel size. We'll see what tomorrow brings; my hopes are up.
Oh it's just qualifying, oh heck 27.5" win Qualifyinggggggggggg, OmG
Internet will have a melt down!!
Trump tweets fake, news fake news, 27.5" did not win QUALIFYING, it's fake, you are all fake! 29ers and lockouts are the best, because they are so narly!!! And as President I really like skin suits and the UCI....
so was Atwill on the hardtail for qualifying ??? musta been since the track is soooooo easy ???? ... less moaning and more speed might have helped him a bit
you are all drawing strange conclusions from this moaning. they never said it's easy and that's why they'll win, they probably just want to ride more challenging stuff to get creative with lines and so on, even if the are not at the sharp end. it's probably easier for these riders to stand out on a track like val di sole...
Yes there are. check the UCI's website for previous races to see the breakdown. 1st is 50, 2nd is 40, 3rd I think is 30, then 25, then it goes down from there until 1. ...That's all unless they changed it for this season, which I don't think they did.
Gwin is better than Minaar, but they are both awesome dudes! Good luck gentlemen, we know Hart will never win a race again with this ill-suited machine, his body needs to be on 26ers. hahahaha.
Technically he's not as Minaar is GOAT. However I'm sure the Gwin has more wins in a shorter timeframe and will probably take the GOAT title if he continues racing long enough. The amount of wins he had for Trek alone must put him near the top, he's very talented no doubt, but he isn't necessarily better.
@clarky78: Depends on how you define "better". Minaar may have more wins, but I have a feeling that Gwin's wins-per-year is probably higher, so give him a few years.
Kevin was probably making a skill comparison anyway. He thinks Gwin's a more skilled rider.
@jimmythehat: er... Except Minaar is. He has more wins. Nico did however dominate for a period when it seems he was untouchable a lot like Gwin did back on Trek, but as results go it's Minaar.
@clarky78: Rubbish, Nico has 5 world cup overalls and 7 world champs, he was a winning machine who gave up to go rallying for some competition, and was still making enduro podiums in his forties, a few more wins doesn't get close I'm afraid. Greg is a legend but goat, no way.
Just putting this out there, has any other rider won a race without a chain for basically the entire course? I believe only one man holds that 'title.'
IMHO John Tomac is the GOAT of MTB (DH, XC, Dual Slalom) and at one point served as trainer for Gwin. Off-road speed is part of his DNA. Check out his son Eli - first MX racer ever to win his first pro race and John is his coach/trainer.
Could you be, please, a little more respectful with the people that don't think like you ? We can talk and share our views; no need to offend each other .......... Thank you ☺ By the way, Gwin is giving a nice testimony ☺. Well done, Aaron !!
Because he's not a brainwashed cultist. Christianity is a guiding light for him, but it doesn't mean he obsesses over every word in the Bible as literal law for how to live his life -- that's what Muslims do and it's called Sharia law -- you should know that pretty well as you're from Sweden... Now quit being a prick and move along
Buy new stuff......
What happened to Vergier and Bruni? Did they get stuck in traffic?
edit: their times are gone - must have been caught up in traffic from a crash or something
How did Gwin get 2 seconds on Minnaar who got 5 seconds on the rest of the pack? The guy is a machine!!!
You just answered your own question.
Gwin IS a machine.
He didn't do very well in Lourdes did he?
He's great when it's fast, open and bermed. Especially when Jesus is looking down on him.
He's just fast at bikes mate, in general.
Yeah you're right jclnv, he didn't do too well at Lourdes. No one did that raced in the rain. Pretty sure he killed it last year on his first race on YT. Love the PB crowd that can't be part of the fun but always part of the bullshit. Must be a shit existence.
I have to agree a bit.
Based on Gwins own words, he can finally take a breath after the race run.
Not that anyone holds back during qualifying, but I think they're all running at 95% up until the race. Before that they have to preserve themselves for the race and only go full on for one run.
Pretty amazing that at the top of an amazingly talented field there is still so much variety with success.
Gwin hasn't won in 9 months.
Hart killed it to end the season but hasn't resumed where he left off.
Minnaar has tons of critics because of his age but still has the potential to win another title.
Then there's 10 other guys who are legit threats every race.
This is the best sport on the planet!!!
PS. Loris Vergier is the man.
Love that kid.
Bruni was citing this as his main concern; that the tracks are getting easier and that the bikes compounding that. So he wants ether small wheels and the current tracks, or 29" and harder/rougher/steeper tracks. That being said, he's very keen on suspension testing...
I totally agree that it doesn't seem to be making a difference to results though, just making the taller riders more comfortable. I suppose we will end up with two category's for DH bikes; 27.5 Race/Park and a 29 Race specific or for taller riders.
what does 'rough' mean to you?
On a rough, straight blown out fireroad the 29er might be faster
On really rough tracks with tight twists and turns drops, g-outs - think val di sole - I see an advantage for smaller wheels because its easier to do body enlglish on them...
For a fixed, equally distributed mass, larger diameter wheels have a larger moment of Inertia. If you started a large and a small wheel rolling at the top of a hill, the small one would reach the bottom of the hill first.
If the track were perfectly smooth, you'd rather be running 26ers.
The advantage of a big wheel is that it has greater rotational inertia. This means that rough stuff tends to slow it down less than an otherwise equivalent, smaller diameter wheel.
Many people say 27.5 accelerates out of corners faster and 29ers are harder to get up to speed initially. Physics would back this up but would also say that a 29 inch wheel would have a higher top speed compared to 27.5. It doesn't equate to the real world so much though in my eyes...
Imagine the backlash if they had an event called 29 ______.
Speed is nothing without control.
He had a big crash on the final jump.. looked really bad.
Cuz it seems like the complaints this year of "too smooth" are directed at the lack of advantage of the 29.
Can't wait for the results.
1. GWIN Aaron 3:10.271
2. MINNAAR Greg 3:12.519 +2.248
3. GREENLAND Laurie 3:15.437 +5.166
4. FEARON Conner 3:17.200 +6.929
5. THIRION Remi 3:17.218 +6.947
Gwin
Minaar
Brosnan
Bruni
Vergier
I like the progress, even if it's incremental and sometimes bs comes out (like boost), but it's undeniable how bikes now are better at a set price than a few years ago
That last point doesn't seem important, so you have the first two to think about.
Oh it's just qualifying, oh heck 27.5" win Qualifyinggggggggggg, OmG
Internet will have a melt down!!
Trump tweets fake, news fake news, 27.5" did not win QUALIFYING, it's fake, you are all fake! 29ers and lockouts are the best, because they are so narly!!! And as President I really like skin suits and the UCI....
Thought he and some other whiners would qualify fastest... Hmmm?
Strange there's the usual suspects on top on every track...
#winandthencomplain
Kevin was probably making a skill comparison anyway. He thinks Gwin's a more skilled rider.
By the way, Gwin is giving a nice testimony ☺. Well done, Aaron !!
@PBStaff ... live timing link make it compulsory