The phrase "win on Sunday, sell on Monday" is a cliché for a reason. It's tempting to think that if a bike is good enough to perform at the top level, it must be a good bike. If it's winning races, it must be
really good.
But there are a few problems with that line of argument.
For one thing, professional racers are, by definition, paid to ride a particular bike or product. When I've asked racers about the bike and setup they're riding, I think they're remarkably honest - they don't tend to repeat the marketing material or try to sell the bike they're riding - but I think it's harder to be honest with yourself if riding at the absolute limit depends on having absolute faith in your equipment. You'll occasionally hear racers talk about testing things "just to confirm" it's the best it can be, or wanting to stick with what's worked in the past rather than testing different setups with open-minded curiosity about which works best. They have a huge incentive to convince
themselves that their setup is giving them every possible advantage.
For this reason, pro racers can be quite conservative with bike choice and setup, and those who are at the top of their game are probably the most conservative - why change if it's working?
Jack Moir raced last year's bike at the first round of the 2022 EWS, then rode the new bike in a size small at round two.
A case in point would be Jack Moir. The 2021 Enduro World Series champ chose to ride his 2021 race bike for the first round this year, saying he hadn't done enough testing on the
2022 Canyon Strive by the first round. In
his vlog, he said that he wanted to make the new bike "as close as I can to the bike I rode last year...to get a comfortable feeling on this bike for the first round," so chose to ride a size small, which has a similar wheelbase and reach to the 2021 size large. That makes sense, given he was riding so well on the old one and he didn't have long to adjust to something radically different before the season started.
But Moir's decision to ride a size small, at 185 cm or 6'1", has a lot of commenters convinced that shorter bikes are better, the trend towards longer bikes is an industry conspiracy, and we'll all be back riding smaller bikes as soon as riders stop being brainwashed and wake up to the #truth.
Well, there are a couple of problems with that. For one thing, there's no way of knowing if Jack Moir, or any other top racer, could have ridden even faster on a different bike, frame size, or setup. That's because, unlike in a scientific experiment, in racing there's no control, no way to test what would have happened if one of those variables were different. Even if someone wins a race by ten seconds, that doesn't tell you if the bike they were riding is any good; for all we know, they might have won by twenty seconds on another bike. Put another way, the race result doesn't tell you anything about the bike because different bikes are ridden by different riders.
Besides, it's not as if every racer is going toward shorter bikes. In downhill, world champ Greg Minnaar is running his V10 about as long as it will go, and even in enduro where a shorter bike is more appropriate given the tight trails and minimal practice, Moir is an outlier.
Greg Minnaar's got his V10 set up pretty lengthy, with a custom headset that adds 5.2mm in reach and slackens the head angle by half a degree, forks fully extended and chainstay in the long setting.
Of course, some professional racers arrange test sessions in the off-season to try out different frame sizes or geometries, swapping back and forth and comparing times. But mountain biking isn't like Formula 1: there are so many variables that can change from one run to the next that it's very hard to determine if one setup is "faster" than another. Besides, a new setup can take a while to get used to -
Greg Minnaar said he tried a prototype longer DH bike in the early 2000's (which was significantly shorter than modern bikes) and didn't like it at first, so went back to the even smaller bike. Similarly, it took a surprisingly long time for EWS and downhill racers to embrace 29" wheels after they became viable, considering that now they seem like the obvious choice, at least for tall riders. Or in road cycling, for decades it was taken as read that the narrowest tyres were the fastest, yet we now know that's simply false.
But even if pro racers are able to ride faster on a shorter bike, that doesn't necessarily mean the same's true for the rest of us.
For one thing, most of the top racers have been riding bikes very fast for a very long time. That means their skills and riding style have been honed, at least in part, on bikes which these days would be considered small (any bike built more than five years ago was small by today's standards). This reminds me of an
episode of Mythbusters where they were testing the theory that it was possible to swim through syrup as quickly as through water. They initially wanted to use a professional swimmer to test this but found he wasn't able to adapt his technique (which was perfectly optimised for swimming in water) to the unfamiliar fluid. Instead, they recruited an amateur swimmer who was able to swim almost as fast in the thicker liquid by adapting his technique to take advantage of having more to push against. In case you can't see where I'm going with this, I suspect that pro racers, particularly those who have been competing at a high level for a long time, are less able to adjust to a new style of geometry than those of us learning these skills from a relatively blank slate.
Also, pro riders are able to ride stiffer suspension without getting fatigued. Stiffer suspension makes the bike chassis more stable (there's less pitching and diving during braking or weight transfers) and this may reduce the benefit of a longer wheelbase. I once had the pleasure of riding Gee Atherton's enduro bike, which I believe had around a 480 mm reach and 1,280 mm wheelbase (roughly). I was able to ride it okay, but with his suspension settings it was too firm and harsh for me to do multiple laps, and with softer suspension, it felt a little unstable for my liking. Not terrible, but noticeably more prone to pitching than bikes with 1,300 mm+ wheelbase.
Not all pros are running firm suspension, as this interview with
Innes Graham illustrated, but pro riders are also far more skilled at keeping their body weight at just the right point between the wheels than the average Joe or Jill. Watching the Tweed Valley EWS from the sidelines, it was interesting to see how the fastest riders' bikes remained incredibly level through sections of intense braking or changes of gradient, while the merely "fast" riders bikes were pitching and moving more erratically. Ben Cathro discusses the skills needed to keep the bike level and settled while getting on and off the brakes in the below video. I'm not for a second saying that a longer bike is a substitute for these skills, but that a very experienced rider may be able to get away with a shorter wheelbase without feeling like the bike is pitching and unstable, while a less skilled rider may benefit more from extra stability.
What's the bottom line?To be clear, I'm not trying to convince you that you need a longer bike. Nor am I saying you need a shorter bike, an idler pulley or any other tech trend you may have seen on the podium. I'm arguing against the reasoning which goes: "rider X is riding a certain setup and is winning races, therefore that setup must be better." It's just fundamentally impossible to separate the effect of the bike from that of the rider when it comes to race results - some racers may be conservative with new trends, and what works for a top athlete may be quite different to what's ideal for you or me. So try out as many different bike geometries as you can and ride whatever works best for you, or just be happy with whatever bike you've got. But don't try to justify your geometry theories or bike choices based on what your favourite racer is using.
How do you know without essentially buying one and riding it for a month? Thats kinda the point of watching pros- I want to go fast, so I look at what Moir or Rude is riding for guidance on what bikes are speed optimized. I want to climb like a demon, so perhaps I look at what Flückiger is on. Perhaps I love a playful steed, thats comfortable on big jumps but isn't a chore to throw around. I might see what bike Semenuk is on and investigate his setup.
DH bikes don't really sell much anymore, but its where the technology is innovated, tested, and proven. I love my single pivot, and in the past I haven't been convinced that multipivots are worth the extra complexity. However, Commencal has been going scorched earth on the DH scene lately; maybe there is something to their 6 bar and I should investigate further?
TL;DR: its hard to know what a bike does without riding it or seeing others ride it.
I'd like to see a poll for the number of us who've bought bikes without a test ride, only after a test ride, and stats on how many folks have decided not to buy a bike only after test riding. I'd wager too many folks buy a bike after reading reviews and maybe checking reach, weight, BB height, and chainstay length. And bottle fitment, lol.
I'm still riding the Capra, but really eyeballing the Stumpy Evo Alloy. I currently have my capra set up with the same geo settings I would use on the Evo, but I really want bottle fitment and frame storage.
And if one is to follow what top riders use, should I go for 780 mm bar as some or 720 bar as Innes Graham? Or Moir’s 760?
But I've got the same "problem" that he has. I've got a 36.5in (~92.7cm) inseam, which is pretty long for my height. Thus, I've found I'm relatively more sensitive to stack height (because even if I hinge at the hips, my hips are higher than avg, so I need stack height to match). And you can see that in his bikes where he massively increases stack height.
Conversely, I've got a buddy who while shorter than me (5'8", or ~173cm) is apparently all torso, with a negative ape index. He's got like 28in (71cm) inseam. So a frame that fits him well looks proportionally very different to one that fits me well.
wAkE uP sHeEpLe
I think he meant that the shorter bar transfers stronger steering input to his hands, thus deflecting them from the position he wants them to be.
but don't mind me, keep ranting
If you're a pro that's sponsored by company X, you're going to be riding one particular bike, and modifying it however you can to make it feel right.
Of course, test riding a bike is obviously the best way to see if it'll work for you, and it's good to take reviews with a grain of salt, since the tester's riding style and preferences may not match yours.
This article isn’t about which bike is best, which you guys test a bit. It’s about which size is best (particularly for downhill standing), and you guys don’t test that significantly.
Just look at all the chatter on the forums.....guys gets bike, stoked and it's the best bike he's ever ridden then 2-3 months later he starts asking questions about it, then a few weeks later it's on the PB Market.
that's where looking at pro setups, with a gain of salt, can help, they ride these bikes and optimize them....it can help illustrate how to set up a bike if you ride sim terrain as them and are of sim build.
Many amateur guys do whacky stuff in the name of performance as they have no clue WTF they are doing.
Just look at all the chatter on the forums.....guys gets bike, stoked and it's the best bike he's ever ridden then 2-3 months later he starts asking questions about it, then a few weeks later it's on the PB Market.
:P
enduro-mtb.com/en/enduro-race-bike-mtb-review/#toc_erkenntnisse
Jack, Maes, Rude, Remy…the list goes on Seb, of guys riding shorter bikes. And don’t tell us “oh that track had lots of turns” lol, it’s MTBing, there are lots of turns.
From enduro conclusions:
“Not only did the shorter bikes record faster times, they also allowed our test riders to change direction more quickly and position themselves better before corners to carry their speed through them. On top of that, the agile handling of compact bikes is usually more fun. Anyone who thinks that these bikes aren’t composed at high speeds can rest assured: handling stability is heavily determined by the suspension and all the bikes on test performed brilliantly in this regard.”
If you're a local racer that also rides enduro tracks with switchbacks etc, then you probably will be faster on a shorter bike too.... If you're not racing on tight tracks then go as long as you want... it's that simple.
Seems like a lot of these "don't do what the pros do" articles miss the point - especially that recent GMBN video...
From personal experience I've learned that I go faster on longer frames and I believe it's because I need stability to feel comfortable going fast at the limit.
I have no trouble believing that pros can go much faster then I can with much less stability. I also believe they can use that ability to take advantage of a shorter faster turning bike.
I'm 5-11 with very long legs and currently on a large with a 489 reach. I rode an Xl with a 510 reach and liked it more. I know it's too big for me according to current practice but I had no trouble turning it and can't find any other downside.
The next can of worms to open is, if a longer, more stable and faster bike is more fun for a non-racer like me?
Maybe those scary trails your big bike made fun are what @Artnshel rides every day. Or maybe you're noticeably more skilled so you need less bike or more trail to hit that fun sweet spot.
For a pro, winning is fun. Plus, if you have world class bike handling skills, a more maneuverable bike is going to be faster on technical courses. What feels like a sketchy bike to a normal rider, to a pro, is going to be a bike they can throw around, jump and corner more dynamically with. This is essential when you travel the world, riding trails that are largely or wholly unfamiliar and a lot of line choice is done on the fly.
What I'm trying to get at is that 2 bikes with identical geometry could ride vastly differently if one had a different suspension platform, or a coil shock, maybe even a different brand of suspension. How geometry and design correlate is arguably more important that either one of those in isolation- a steeper head-angled bike that rides deep in it's travel will feel slacker than it is on paper. Think how different your bike can feel with new tires or a different rise bar- it's huge. A bike is a system in which parts work together to operate as a whole- pros may be better at building an intentionally imbalanced system that allows them to play to their strengths, but for ordinary riders its about the right balance.
I guess where I'm going is that trying to distill it to "do x" or "rider y did this" misses the point- you can get close by picking a vaguely correct frame and spec, but setup will define if it actually works for you.
I have ridden 505mm reach bikes - can ride easily, amazing straight lining, but I’m way slower in the corners.
I’ve had plenty of 455-470mm reach bikes, super playful, and at the time, didn’t know any different, put some of my fastest times down on them. But as I moved to a slightly longer reach it gave me more confidence to hit steeper stuff faster. I’ve settled on 480-485mm :-)
If a bike is being annoying in some way to you, maybe due to imperfections in manufacturing, that can be a huge turn-off. Canyon and YT seemingly are notorious for this, despite looking great on paper and in reviews. Santa Cruz seems to deliver a no-hassle easy-to-live with experience, in contrast.
How much is this worth though? Santa Cruz seems to charge like $800+ extra for this peace of mind, compared to the competition.
Regarding different sizes performing better, I'd say that's an issue with chainstay lengths not being proportional with front-center length. If I weren't afraid of BB creak, I'd be interested in a "Ride-9" style system for the BB section, to tune CS length and BB height, which would also affect effective STA, stack, and reach. Tunable dropouts could be an alternative too, but that would compromise rear susp kinematics.
E.g for the same price you pay for a SC Megatower C with GX, Float 36 Performance and RaceFace AR30 rims on 370 hubs, you get a Strive CFR with full XTR, Fox Factory 38s and DT511 on 350 hubs.
A more equivalent build in the Strive (XT, Fox 38 performance elite) is nearly 25% cheaper than the Megatower.
My friend has had a couple of warranty claims on the wheels from his strive and Canyon have been a bit slow but otherwise OK. Santa Cruz have been brilliant with bearing replacements for my other friend’s Tallboy, but on the downside that bike has needed the bearings replaced about every 8 months. Personally I’d much rather pay to have bearings replaced once every 5 years like I did on my old bike than have it in the shop for a week 7 times at no charge.
Also with this comment I am trying to justify liking bikes that are (a little) too short.
Also, was super stoked when Seb joined Pinkbike after his videos on other platforms. Not so stoked anymore, almost every technical article is just him trying to find some science or math to explain his opinions, often not relevant to the way we ride bikes. The center of gravity one being the most obvious of these...
This one, basically saying that Jack would probably go faster on a differnent sized bike is like... what the f*ck man. Their job is to go as fast as possible, dont you think they try everything to get there? In Jacks case he has said in several interviews and on his own channel through the years that he prefers running a longer bike for downhill, but because of the tight and changable nature of EWS in europe he runs a shorter bike and narrower bars because it is faster for him. Then hes start comparing EWS to WC Downhill when he sais not everyone is running a shortish bike, apples to oranges? Richie rude is 6', rides a medium yeti (460 reach), innes graham (in that article you list) is 6' and runs a medium (455 reach with 720mm bar with at that)
Next article will probably be how longer bikes turns better than short ones, oh wait...
Downhill has been chasing the damn rabbit hole while snorting copious amounts of crack with the obsession for bikes to be as long as physically possible but then also stuffing small back wheels into them… cos… oh no shock horror my 2metre wheelbase bike doesn’t turn corners very well and feels like trying to ride a limousine… who’d have thought!
Sizing has gone dumb as shit, especially in the reach department, few manufacturers are actually balancing the geometry for all sizes and many are making it harder and harder to downsize or size up (looking at you Giant).
Like you want more stability and length for taller riders but you refuse to add chainstay length, instead just make the reach 520mm and call it a day? Do these designers even understand that by doing this nonsense every frame size rides like a different bike? And not in a good way.
I’m 183cm without shoes, but my wingspan is 190-191cm and I’ve got a 35-36” inseam… my ape index is significantly higher than the vast majority of people, long reach bikes (your typical “large” these days) do not feel great to me, bikes that are 455-470 immediately feel better to me just from a carpark test never mind actual riding.
Athertons size guide puts me on a 476 reach, which is the bottom end of most larges now, that’s good, because I’ve ridden bikes at 490+ and my current enduro bike is 488mm… I really don’t like it, to get the bike feeling ok I’ve had to run a super short 35mm stem and as much stack height as my steerer tube allows… it still only feels decent when your riding the bike like you stole it on flat out open tracks, the second you are trying to chill at a slower pace or need agility its a total pig to ride.
By comparison, my DH bike is 440 reach and feels great, when it’s time to buy a new DH bike or Enduro bike I’ll be sticking to 460-470 reach max.
According to marketing, the "next model year" bike should be sooo much faster than a four year old design. But it never is.
If todays pros got good riding 26' wheels / 300mm reach bikes (or something like that) it's gotta be possible for me to get better with my horrendously outdated 2019 geometry, right?
JP
So the take away for normal riders is "it all depends how YOU get on with bike XYZ"... I've owned a few bikes that the industry and mates tell me i should have loved and would be amazing.. But i never got on with them, 3 months in, still running wide. "you need to change your riding style"... yeah right, i'm 50 and struggling to get down the trail, let alone completely change how i ride to accommodate it.
Sometimes we as riders will find a bike and instantly when you sit in it, it feels 'right'. That's not the bike, the industry or the Pro factor... it's just how it feels for that rider on that given day.
Or go to your favorite local bike shop where you know you'll get good advice on type of bike for the local trails and fit to your size and style, test one or two options and go from there!?
I live in this lovely place called Emmental, in Switzerland, and that's where I mostly ride. Short wheelbase, cut handlebars, maybe even a mullet set up - sounds perfect for me and for the tight, switchbacky trails I mosrly ride. I'd even be happy with 120mm of travel instead of the 140 that I have. But when I decide to go to the bigger mountains once in a long while, I really enjoy the extra 20mm (or more, if I had) and I might be happy with longer wheelbase...but my bike does just fine on those bigger, speedier trails as I'm so used to it.
My bottom line: Not considering what the pros ride (in relation to terrain) is just as foolish as only considering what pros ride. I for one get some affirmation for my own decision to ride a bike that's a bit "small" for my own size, reading that others feel and do the same.
I call BS and have worked toward learning more about why they choose what they choose. And the closer I get to that setup, the faster and better I feel.
Hump
Here is a relevant tome: www.cambridge.org/core/books/counterfactuals-and-causal-inference/5CC81E6DF63C5E5A8B88F79D45E1D1B7
Setup varies person-to-person, pro or not. Learn what the dials and knobs on your suspension do, and play with the settings. Maybe try swapping volume spacers. Figure out the ideal tire pressures for the tires you ride.
Get your seat height juuuuust right and sweat your bar position, grips, and controls.
Or not-ride what you have however you want to-but you won't get the most out of your bike (or yourself).
2: EWS courses are more relatable than Greg and a DH bike. 3: commencal making their bike shorter(am into sx) and now making a newer, even shorter prototype.
I’m not saying one is better but there is definitely something going on with this and geometry hitting it’s limit for length. I don’t know what the right answer but blindly following the “longer is better because PB said” isn’t true anymore. Enduro Mag guys found the same…you know, when they tested Jacks ACTUAL BIKE on and ACTUAL EWS TRAIL.
Stopped taking them seriously when they complained about exo casings being prone to flats on one review and then whined that DD tires were too hard to pedal up the hill in the next one. Or when they said cable routing through the stem was neat.
I always find PB seem like they are influenced by the Companys and dont really ride on trails that the average person does.
Vital for sure is pretty good but they have some shocking Things, like when they tested 29 vs 27.5 and they used two completely different bikes lol or when they complained at shimano about the brakes on a bike coming poorly bled.
They reviewed the status at a jump park... like come on... one of the vital guys also comes across super arrogant.
In the end Support your local shop - ask them - try a bike or 2 based on there recommendation because more than likely they are going to fix it or modify for you for your needs and they ride the trails you do most of the time. Plus they will support the local trail association/ builders that are more important than gear / pro influence on line.
The longer bike is intrinsically stable, so I have been able to run my suspension softer and faster rebound for more grip without it getting out of hand. 10 years ago I was dialing up the rebound to calm the whole bike down.
Plus, amazing riders use the agility of a shorter bike to react and move their bike around trail features. For muggles like me with many many fewer tools in my skills cupboard, having my long wheelbase bike look after me and keep things calmer (and occasionally just be OK ploughing through stuff a pro might be able to skip around/up/over) is a much better proposition for me, and I suspect most riders out there.
I've experimented with long bikes and short bikes, I don't think long bikes are necessarily more stable, it's a package and there are a lot of variables that make a bike stable....I ride my shorter bike which is ~40mm shorter than the longer one I had with same confidence down same trails....with more maneuverability. Being centered on bike with proper weight of F/R wheels is a bigger factor IMO....
I'm currently on an XL DH bike and a medium/large for anything else now. End of the day that's what is fastest and most comfortable for me.
I remember 'Crankworx' where famous slopestyle riders set on 'cheap' (Suntour) suspension while delivering the most advanced combos.
Experience is almost the valuable one and only parameter whether omeone is the 'best' - whether he's on Suntour or FOX.
But I have a question: Why does Pinkbike promote that very thing?
Clearly the advertisers want us to buy what racers run ....
Peer pressure and social media sell bikes.
Mtn bikers tend to pursue individuality. There are so many brands out there that I don’t ride with anyone that has the same bike as my other friends.
For e.g there are alot of bikes in the 3500 area that ride better/same then the 6k+(talking complete bikes here)
I'll always argue that an expensive botique bike is just that "botique" that doesnt mean it performs any better lol
My bikes are like underwear, Cant wear the same pair for too long lol.
"it fits me perfect"
"if the perfect bike for the trail"
"it's so confidence inspiring"
6 months later they buy something else and say the same thing.....
In fact, some arguments in the text are a little bit put or not taken into account.
Greg Minnaar for example is a big guy and the V10 is a relativly short bike with small sizing. Even the biggest size is not realy big.
Another point is that by now some pros have already ridden bigger bikes and have gone back to smaller bikes. And that is a point that should really make you think.
The marketing machinery of the bike industry has also propagated a lot of nonsense. Think of the low front ends and flat bars on DH bikes.
I'm not saying that all bikes are too long, but currently there is a trend to too long bikes.
Body proportions are also not taken into account enough. I, like Jack Moir, am someone with long legs and short torso and arms. Medium bikes are almost always too low, large bikes often too long. It is difficult to find a good bike for me these days. The Strive is not a bike I would want, but if I had to take it, I would take it in small. I am 1.80cm. (5'11")
One thing about suspension settings, I've discovered many setup guides seem to be geared towards "Pro-level" riders. I have found I need to run the fork and rear shock air pressures a fair bit softer than recommended for the bike to feel comfortable for the way I ride.
In the end, you can make your bike significantly faster by learning how to ride better, or just hand it to someone else.
But fact is, that length icreases stability. For most people, the added stability is going to make them more confident and thus better riders. There is obviously a functional size limit for everything, as the human body is only so big on average, but as it stands currently, a lot people would be faster and better riders if they were on a frame with 500mm reach.
I can get behind of Amaury or Greg needing long bikes to go a million miles an hour down Mt St Anne and control it, but while it is true that a longer bike is more stable at speed, it is also much harder to get into turns (and if we are honest most average joes' first "to do" on the list is corner better), manual/wheelie, readjust in the air... in short, much less maneuvrable.
I might be alone on this, but as an average joe, what I want my bike to be no 1,2 and 3 is FUN, with capital letters, and to me that means poppy, reactive, able to go down anywhere. Do I think a longer bike would be better when riding a DH world cup track or going faster than I know I should be rinding? Yes I do. But that to me does not make up for the 95% rest of the time. I'd much rather rely on my own skills and balance to keep the bike level and have a lively bike.
PS: Anecdotical evidence at best, but I ride a 2021 Meta AM29 in size M (I am 1,7 , and last weekend got to try the AM SX in size L, and to my needs and expectations of a bike, I was happy to see my reasoning for going for an M myself and not an L confirmed: the L felt massive for me, and uncomfortable in turns/manuals/jumps... aka what makes bike riding furn for me.
Pitching and diving control, which is low speed compression damping, is largely a factor of rider weight and riding position, not really riding speed, and is not a major driver in fatigue. High speed compression damping and firm springs, both used for controlling big and/or fast hits and big landings, is where fatigue come from.
And it's often more likely that _too little_ low speed compression damping (allowing _more_ pitching and diving) can drive fatigue faster since it leaves you more often in a firmer range of the spring and closer to the end of travel.
Gee rides "stiff suspension" via big springs rates and firm high speed compression damping so that he can put more of his energy into the bike. It might be considered "more fatiguing" for him as well, since it takes more energy to go fast, period. Anyone has to put in more effort to get out more speed. But it's usually not seen as "fatiguing" to go fast, rather just that it takes more effort to go fast.
If you wanted to even try to approach that same speed, even just in tiny bursts, you will also need to ride that stiff of suspension in order to get more of your energy into the bike. Attempting it on soft suspension could actually make you more fatigued as you try to load it up but it doesn't push back as much. More energy in, less energy out, that equals tired.
Why doesn't this apply to everyone? Most people have very little time to adjust to something radically different, since they might only have one or two days a week to ride at all. If the professionals who's jobs are literally to ride bikes, don't have time to adjust to new bikes, why would Weekend Warrior Wally, who might have just 15 minutes in the parking lot before the Thirsty Thursday Ride, magically be able to adjust to a bike that jumps 2 sizes ("a size small, which has a similar wheelbase and reach to the 2021 size large") in one year? Wouldn't it be better to know that since a pro couldn't adjust during a whole pre-season, maybe if Wally upgrades then he should downsize by one or even two size, rather than spend most of the year trying to get used to a bike that is "radically different"?
Otherwise, if you don't get the bike/setup that matches your goals/terrain/skillset, you are wasting money big time.
I agree and have learned actually a lot from learning how pros setup their bikes. Not to imitate their setups necessarily as much as to learn more about the principles involved. I would listen to a pro about bike setup long before I listen to a trendsetter or marketing person about bike setup.
If we didn’t we’d all be wearing jorts & wife beaters
(Answer: look at their own personal actions )
So someone wanna buy a L frame ?