Recently, one of mountain biking's original freeriders posted an Instagram photo of himself out for a ride. Now, normally this wouldn't be a big deal – just another day in the office for a pro rider slightly past his prime trying to keep his sponsors happy with little pictures and long lists of hash tags. Except that he was on an electrically assisted mountain bike. Mind you, this is a rider who was once famous for riding the slipperiest, gnarliest trails around, back when most riders were still sporting spandex and rocking bar ends. Seeing him on an e-bike was like seeing Guy Martin puttering around on a Honda Goldwing trike, or Cedric Gracia sipping tea and knitting a sweater – it just didn't seem right.
Now, I understand that maybe, just maybe, there's a place in the world for e-bikes. If a little old lady has her driver's license taken away and wants to save energy while pedaling to the store for some Metamucil, fine, she can use an e-bike. But off-road, electrically assisted mountain bikes? They shouldn't exist, yet somehow they're gaining traction in the marketplace, especially in Europe. At last year's Eurobike trade show there were electric motors bolted to every type of bike imaginable, with eager salesman waiting to pop out of their booths and spout off the list of benefits that a heavy motor brings to mountain biking. Most of these sales pitches were along the lines of, “It allows you to go farther then you would be able to without a motor.”
Now you can say you've seen an electric enduro bike. News flash: I really don't want more people out on the trails, especially not ones that are too lazy to rely solely on human power to transport them deep into the backcountry. Call me selfish, but I like being able to pedal far enough into the woods that the crowds are left miles behind, and although it hasn't happened yet, I'm dreading the day when the buzz of an electric motor interrupts my otherwise peaceful bike ride. And what happens if that magical motor craps out on its slightly-out-of-shape rider thirty miles into a ride? That's going to be a mighty haul out, especially since most e-bikes weigh more than a downhill bike.
This is not okay.E-bikes are every mechanic's nightmare, as anyone who's ever thrown their back out trying to heft one into a shop workstand knows, especially the ones that unwitting consumers purchase off of late night television. Try telling that little old lady you can't fix her 60 pound behemoth because you lack the necessary soldering or electrical know-how to rewire the poorly constructed contraption. I'd bet that the majority of the people who think they need an electric assist to ride a bike haven't actually ridden since their college days, when everyone rode steel Schwinn Varsitys that weighed twice as much as today's much lighter and much better shifting options. The extra weight is only one part of why e-bikes don't make sense, especially ones intended for off-road use. With modern mountain bikes available that weigh in under 30 pounds and have six inches of travel, why would anyone want to purchase a bike that weighs (and costs) twice as much?
As mountain bikers, we need to stick together and take a stand to protect the integrity of the sport against these electric intruders. Mountain bikes are human powered, end of story. Sure, climbing uphill can be hard - you might even sweat and breathe heavily while doing it, but trust me, it's worth it. E-bikes don't have a place on the trails, and the efforts being directed at developing them would be much better spent elsewhere. If those electrical engineers need a bike related project they can start by trying to figure out how to make an electronic, wireless dropper post that costs less than a month's rent, or some kind of shop tool with lasers that makes it easy to get a stem perfectly aligned the first time. Plus, does anyone truly believe that an industry that can't even agree on what handlebar diameter works best is really ready to add complicated electronics to the mix?
And what about the un-named pro who posted that image of himself mountain biking on an e-bike? He's wearing lederhosen and striped socks in his most recent Instagram photo, so it's possible that he's gone insane, which would go a long ways towards explaining his e-bike experimentation.
I personally have nothing against e-bikes. Heck if I had the money I'd buy an e-motorcrosser. I'd rather electric over gasoline, less noise and no fumes.
Fear of trails getting closed?
That said, i can understand people riding E bikes because of an injury; but for my part, i don't ride when i'm injured
New Zealand has un-countable shuttle trails, and actually have shuttle services for a great majority of the trails. As someone who's family is from ( and still lives) New Zealand, how dare you suggest that the U.S. is the only country who shuttles trails. your a fool. Come ride some trails in the Pacific Northwest and climb a few 10 mile roads before you take shit about shuttling haha.
nice work, your life must be total garbage.
congrats white trash loser.
Firstly. I pose to you, who has ever seen electronic driven bikes on the trail? Or even a busy trail centre? I have not. Probably because they are too expensive, and people would call you out for being lazy. Which it is.
Secondly, assume, someone who suffers from a disability, be it heart problems, asthma, lack of one limb,anything that hinders their access to ride. Are they not allowed a aid to help them rip up the hill like the rest of us? Can they ride without a stigma attached to them, to have fresh blowing between their scalps and reacting to speed as they lose themselves in the moment, forgetting the stress and problems as they flow through a trail.
Of course fat lazy riders should not use them, its detrimental to them and us as a community. But don't slate something that could help a fragment of our community.
Nobody owns the backcountry. If someone's out there enjoying themselves, all power to them. It's not up to me to dictate the how or why of why they're there.
An E-bike will not cause massive problems on the trail, as people buying them are most likely novices, or injured riders. They will stick to more groomed trails. Getting more people outside, and away from electronic entertainment is good.
So @willie1 you are right it seems like novices using them, and novices in general have no effing trail etiquette and around here "the more groomed trails" are the ones littered with other trail users. on a normal pedal bike a novice isn't going very fast and can't cover much ground and are more of a danger to themselves so it's not a big deal.
They do have a place in adaptive sports I agree. That place is not in trail centers, although they can be used responsibly, but in my opinion I think an E bike has as much of a right of way on the trail as an off leash dog. If you hear someone 100 yards away pull that thing to the side and let everyone go by and do that every single time. Maybe make it so the pedal assist turns off at like 8 mph instead of 25mph. In general those things infuriate me, but in reality it's the people using them. Im sure there are people who ride them and understand what real mt biking, use them responsibly and fly right under the radar.
The collective that is the typical PB user lambastes PB reviewers for being "in the industries pocket" etc even when reviews are objective and critical then lays into them again for having opinions in, wait for it, OPINION pieces.
*sigh*
Both are equally valid.
Why take a stand? Would you take a stand if people started riding moto's on your local trails or would you simply say- "Dont like them, dont ride them"
The problem I see is "ability"- Its the ability for someone with very little "ability" to grab through a leg over a e-bike (50-60lbs) and blast through trails- those No Motorized Vehicle trails. Suppose that disabled rider who lacks the ability to pilot a non-motorized bike spokes a horse, clips a hiker or tackles a trail runner and its game over, cancel Christmas and shackle trail access!
Its an Emo Ped
Does anyone else find this as humorous as I do?
Mike, I respect that it's your opinion presented in the article, I just don't happen to agree with it at present... I'm not even sure what 'dumbing down the sport' means? You want to keep the bar high so fewer people can take part unless it's on your terms?
There's this elitist attitude I find really distastful in the mountain bike scene, it's like people who are mountain bikers don't want other people joining the fun unless it meets their approval or their rules. Seems like people are often really quick to judge.
This is happening and in 5-10 years, it's going to be mostly accepted to have some sort of e-assist on a mountain bike. Yes, there are going to be trail access clashes and yes people will argue that these are nothing but small electric motocross bikes. But when that happens, all mountain bikers have to stand together, e-bikers and everyone else and fight together for trail access.
Lighten up.
Go ride a bike. Any bike.
So what im I supposed to ask my buddy to give up on his opportunity to ride again because he looks stupid on an ebike?
Sorry mike but in this case friends let friends ride ebikes.
Bonus: no shuttle vehicle emissions.
From my own experience I can say, above certain pain threshold I usualy find that I am lazy. And I am sure that is far from what I could endure, I quit quickly. This feeling of: you are fkng lazy and you know it! If people would hear the doubts you have at this moment in your head, they'd tell you: you are freaking lazy! Go try again! We are who we are when nobody is watching. When we ride with friends, sorry, we are with the best cheer leaders we can have no matter how much we suck. The biggest thing we can win is not the time on the clock, POD, interview on Dirt TV - it is overcoming your weakness, learning about yourself, and you do it by making things challenging. As Slavoj Zizek says: True freedom is not about transcendence, blessful state - this you can reach on a couch if you add enough philosophical value to online surfing or watchin TV - true freedom HURTS, and doing stupid sht for reasons that are hard to understand for vast majority of people, including your friends - is what makes you free.
Electric engine takes away the price to pay for an uphill - why is it worse than lifts and shuttling? Because bla bla bla bla bla . NO matter how many bla blas you put, it depends solely on why you take a lift or a truck...
www.amazon.com/Wilderness-American-Mind-Roderick-Frazier/dp/0300091222
I read it back in the 80s and have never forgotten it. Brilliant read and it might appeal to you.
Now electric commuter bikes are meant to minimize car traffic, help disfunctioned to keep on cycling. The reality is, they are used by everybody, from one simple reason: they are easier to ride. I talked to an owner of a company called "Eco ride" who can barely keep up with the demand. He said it clearly, the best selling point is: "you sweat less", you come clean and tidy when you come to work or to a meeting. Now another Swedish brand "Apollo" is about to release electric bikes for kids, because their perfectly healthy parents who already bought "eco" bike want their kids to start exercising on bikes, and to not discourage them with the hardship, they make electric engine assisted kid bikes...
To keep things balanced, to stay closest to the truth, such bike is just a tool. Just like any other - It can be misused. Truth is - it will be misused. Truth is: attmepts to remove existing tools by force leads to deviations. Communists and environemntalists rarely get that. Now to opinion making, the only reason why knives are used more often to cut food, than to kill other people is social engineering, which main tool is opinionating like the thing Mike does here. He speaks the voice of conscience.
There's also the question of giving someone unfit the tools to get into a remote place when they don't have the fitness or skills to get back. Transporting someone who can't do prolonged exercise 10 miles away from the nearest road seems like a bad idea to me.
For commuters and leisure cyclists I'm all for it. People with knee or hip replacements or other long term injuries are often only able to do "light cycling" and e-bikes give them a get out of jail free card when a steep hill comes along.
Or the trail that is directional for a reason. A bunch of e-douches decides they are going to try riding up a directional trail, just because they can. They destroy what was once an awesome singletrack decent.
I worry about groups of e-bikes that are heavier bikes overall, with huge suspension and big tires, slogging around on muddy trails, with "delimited" motors allowing for higher speeds and more torque.
Now every MTB trail advocacy club will need to stock up on "No Motorized Vehicles INCLUDING e-bikes!"
It's not difficult to imagine that the same NIMBY campaign groups who have successfully marginalised 4x4 access in some areas will target MTBers next, and that "the bikes have motors now" will become part of their campaign. That's my concern, I don't really care about strava times, or "cheating", just about the perception of our sport. To be honest there are plenty of non-motorised MTBers who could up their game when it comes to that kind of thing!
Well then if i can do my normal ride + add 1 or 2 downhills because i am still fresh to go up again, well then yeah I will definitly ride an E-bike!
Also, i will be 10 years older and i will maybe not have anymore the physical condition i have now, but i will still want to have as much fun as today. If i can get some help, i am taking it.
Today, i do not want a E-bike because they are to heavy and i imagine it kills the fun when going down (never actually tried one)
Oh yeah! and then you go to a bikepark by car (a gas intruder) and take one of those electronical intruders called cableways to climb the hill.
Don't be a hypocrite or want to tell others what to do on this.
Or what if you are a really wealthy e-bike retailer, who goes bankrupt, unless someone buys your stupid bikes.. So theres many reasons But one thing is for sure, dont count yourself a montainbiker, if you have one of these.
Well I have ridden one and I am not a fat lazy rider either! (I ride 120+ miles a week on the road and regularly trails and races off road at the weekends) so I am no stranger to some hard pedalling!
Comparing an ebike to a normal MTB is not comparing apples with apples, it's a different sport! Nor is it an easy option!
Instead of cruising the trails, the ebike gave me the extra boost to push even harder! Smash out the climbs and race to the next descent, which is the fun bit anyway!! Descending is just like before, no assistance is needed, so no "cheating" there... Or use the assist on flat sections which are usually a drag! Tear through the flat sections like they are descents of a "normal" bike!
Also...
Who likes waiting for an uplift? I sure don't! I have been up the hill and descended in the time they are loading up the bikes onto the trailer! If you want a day riding a bike park or short -mid DH runs, this is the tool for the job. Ride up instead of push up, make the most of the day!
...and is that less lazy than getting the uplift bus????
It makes sense, but let me clarify, its no replacement for an MTB.
Don't hate until you have ridden one!
I'm with you about one point: if you're a true mountain lover and trail rider, you've got to suffer to get to the top of the mountain. You've got to suffer to deserve being alone on a high mountain top and enjoy the view, the silence, and of course the descent.
But that's it. I don't agree with all the rest of your article, and being part of the bike industry I don't even feel your words are coming from an industry insider as well.
Why would being electrically assisted on the way up be so hatefully prohibited, whereas shuttling in big, noisy and polluting 4x4 vehicles legit?
How many people are going to use an e-MTB ro ride alpine trails? You seem to think there is going to be an e-bike invasion on your favourite trails. Really?? Please... MTB is not going to be a common sport, no matter what, and there won't be loads of e-MTB's on your trails. At the moment we see new people renting XC e-bikes during their holidays to ride along in the woods. These people would have not rented a standard bike otherwise, and they won't be riding technical trails, never.
Whereas e-MTB's are new, e-bikes are not. They've been around for many years now and we know what works and what doesn't. We mostly sell e-bikes to commuters, not only grandmas. These new riders prefer to spend their money for a bike and not for a car or a motorbike to get to work. These people are buying their equipment in bike shops, not online (yet...).. Want to support your LBS? During the last 3-4 years, our e-bike department has been able to get the shop out of a difficult financial situation. Where are the DHers, trail riders, dirt jumpers? Online...
You don't like e-MTB's: that's fine! But you talk about them the same way hydraulic disc brakes, suspensions, carbon etc... were critized at their time: without knowing, being pessimistic and totally blind towards the improvements and benefits the industry can get, which is very narrow minded.
I have a 10 speed hardtail trail bike. It is not the best bike for doing just about anything (my regular riding partner kicks my arse everywhere but on twisty flat or downhill singletrack). But it's the bike I chose because it meets the parameters I set for myself. My personal parameters do not include electronic assist and are unlikely to at any point in the future (by the time I'm old and decrepid enough to be able to use that decrepitude as an excuse, the downhill bits of trail will be kicking my arse just as much as the uphill anyway). All of which is fine for me. Other bikes that fall outside my personal set of standards include DH rigs you need to push or drive uphill and light as a feather XC bikes that cost a ridiculous amount of cash and require me to have an arse of steel to ride.
But if you want to ride these go right ahead. If I one day become unfeasonably wealthy I may join you. My personal opinion is that those other bikes exist outside of what I want from Mountain Biking as a hobby and while I'm pretty sure I will never be convinced otherwise, I also remember thinking suspension was a load of superfluous shit so who knows. Be happy with whatever Mountain biking box you have chosen to live in. If the choice someone else makes is not screwing it up for you - why should you give a shit.
Steve Jones was there the other day on a cube leccy bike and loved it. He rode to the top and down the standard track dh in 8 minutes, it takes 25 minutes in the van! Plus it isn't a lazy option you still have to pedal it, it doesn't do it all for you. All the haters are just jealous, no one enjoys busting their guts to the top to not get the full enjoyment out of the downs because of tiredness. You can now have a bike to do it all xc and dh.
Don't slate it till you've ridden one and when you have you'll understand.
A friend has a townie bike with e-assist, it's awesome. We live in a town with some large hills and it allows her to get groceries, ride to work etc.
As for the lazy riders?
Don't worry, they're too lazy to be out riding anyway.
If they're out there riding an e bike, doesn't that simply mean they just enjoy the experience cycling?
To each their own, there's nothing wrong for anyone to do what they enjoy w the effort they deem neccessary.
No, I have not ridden an e Mtb before, but I'm looking forward to trying one.
Why reject new ideas afterall?
But hey, if those gadgets, inventions, evolutions or whatever you want to call it can help people ride more, longer, better or simply just ride to have fun on a bike, well so be it! Let’s all ride and be happy and healthy together.
Please don’t make mountain a select club of snobbish individual, and don’t forget bikes are the most democratic way of transportation after your legs!
Of course I built myself an exceptionally cool ebike.
People can say whatever they want about ebikes but until they've actually tried one you are unlikely to form an objective opinion. It is impossible to ride one without enjoying yourself. - Ever had a lousy time at the Go Cart Track...? Probably not.
These bikes already have a place in cycling and are here to stay, with emerging battery technology things are going to get silly-fun!
Having said that, a DH bike with a motor? Not for me. Takes away from the connection of; rider-earth-gravity.
If you want to freeride in the backcountry with a motor, buy a four-stroke Ktm shred the uphills and the downhills with super powers, that's what I do.
People that hate ebikes are just like the outdated crusty people that alienate skateboarders or the old school cyclists that frowned upon DH riding in its early days. Is taking a chairlift to the top of a mountain and bombing down cheating...? Is shuttling with trucks cheating.
When you hate things you alienate yourself from the ever changing world around you. Embrace the changes my friends its all good!
Like any vehicle, if used in a harmful way to other people or environment it is a problem. Ridden with respect and it is just another bike on the trail. Ride hard, ride free.
First, we are not simply lazy. I'm 6'1" 190lbs, I lift, and when it's time to do cardio I hit the treadmill. Cycling for me is about pleasure. Ebikes are intensely pleasurable to ride because of the severe disparity between the size/weight of the vehicle and the propulsive force. Some of the high end kits can achieve top speeds of 55+mph, while even 'cheap' ones easily hit 35 on flat stretches, provided at least a 1kw motor and a lithium battery capable of providing the motor with the amperage it wants.
This level of performance comes as a pretty wicked delight, from something you can easily pick up and carry, or even fold away into a briefcase. Especially since the silent, smooth, fumeless power that's moving you seems to come from nowhere and can later be fully replenished in a little over an hour for less than a dime. That's god damned wizardry. Riding a performance ebike feels like Zeus descended from the heavens, tenderly cupped your buttcheeks and then flung you over the horizon at warp 9 while you hold down the throttle and cackle like a demented goblin. It's not proper cycling, no argument here, but it's fantastic fun, and you should try it before you knock it. Nobody's going to take away your master cyclist card or judge you as harshly as you've judged ebike riders in this article.
perfect ending to their $10k adventure into mtbiking
I really don't care if there is a motor, varying wheel size, suspension or whatever else involved.
Getting on the trails is what it's all about.
I'm not going to lie, the first time I heard of the things I was honestly disgusted by the things!... Until i rode one!
4 of us went out, all on e-bikes. All mixed ability. Myself (regular trail rider) 2 guys in their late 30s, one with a replacement hip and a 21 year old MX racer! The 4 of us could ride together, limited only by bike handling ability!
Its a rare experience to be able to ride a trail in a mid sized group (with big ability range) and not having to wait around for people!
Ebikes cannot be judged without being ridden. I'll admit I don't actually own one, but whenever the opportunity comes to demo one, I always take it!
I see "true mountain bikers" need another target to hate...first it was 27.5/650b, then "enduro", now e-bikes... *sigh*
ebikes got me back into cycling after i got sick and put on a heap of weight, my ebike enabled me to get back on the bike and loose 25kg (55 pounds) while doing it. My cardo has also improved 10 fold.
I ride my ebike to work every day because who wants to arrive at work all sweaty and stinky (there are no showers). Yes some have limited range some don't. One of mine has a 140km (87 miles) range.
I wouldn't say "true mountain bikers" road cyclists are the same if not worse (they insist on hurling abuse at ebike riders) it's more closed minded cyclists.
Technology advances, morphs, and jumps categories over time. E-bikes are a platform for developing the tech around electronic motors. Outright power is less important than decreasing weight and reducing the size of the technology. There will also be a drive to improve weather resistance and overall battery function. At some point in the future (given continued interest) there is likely to be an inflection point that spins the technology back to the moto side. I for one would welcome more mainstream use of electric power. Imagine moto, snow-mobiling, and jet-skis as near silent, low environment impact outdoor activities.
It might be enough to bring me back to those activities - which I loved - but always felt guilty about afterwards.
Its so much fun and at least you have to put in the same power like you would on a normal mtb. You just go 10km/h faster..thats it.
Unqualified comments like this really make me angry!
Youa are ignoring the industrie which is earning so much money with this new trend, which is also paying the development of your new carbon enduro bike!!!
I look at it this way: If you want to ride a bike, ride a bike. If you want to ride a motorcycle, ride a motorcycle.
Sure, it's incredibly satisfying when you reach a set of trails purely under your own steam, and I don't think that will go away any time soon. But e-bikes actually do enable people to ride further than ever before without having to constantly shuttle with pickup trucks. How is that not an improvement? It's also better for the environment.
And bike shop mechanics are supposed to keep up with new technology - that's the nature of their job. Mechanics weren't up in arms when hydraulic brakes were introduced; nor should they be with electronics. People and bike shops must adapt and see new technology as an opportunity, not a threat to their existing business. To not do so is to be left behind.
The sport will always change, and it's up to us to help guide it and foster change. Think of the progress that manufacturers have made in the last decade, none of which would have happened if people kept complaining about the sport becoming "too easy". E-bikes are an opportunity to bring a whole new set of people into the community, and that can only be a good thing.
How cool would it be to have an inner city electric Supercross series running inside old warehouse! It would be almost silent and waaayyy to much fun!
Idea is copyrighted so you have to pay me 1% of any earnings when our new sport gets bigger than the NFL.
"As mountain bikers, we need to stick together and take a stand to protect the integrity of the sport"
Count me out of your little club. Maybe I'll be out on a bike or an e-bike a skateboard or a scooter. Maybe Cedric Gracia and I will be sipping tea and knitting a sweaters. Whatever it is I'll be having fun and not caring what it is you think of me.
Down the road!!
Also, I could see hikers and horses complaining even more because they would also be startled by e-bikes zooming uphill instead of just having to worry about what's coming downhill.
Too bad for me I guess? What if I was that great guy who used to be the one who always had something funny to say during the ridding breaks, (that everyone in the group loved having around) who came out on rainy days to do maintenance when no one else wanted to? and now due to injury my only options maybe the E-Bike!
Come on people we are lucky to have this sport exploding like it is, how many trails and parks are there to ride now then there were 20 years ago? the more 2 wheels we have turning the more terrain we will have for "access", thats what we all seek some kind of "access" whether it's freedom, distance, elevation, technical, scenery,..ect.
I am a two wheeled enthusiast and love everything it stands for!
The guy who wrote this is a douche. I wouldn't wish anyone to have Lupus or any autoimmune disease/illness/disability, but if he could experience what it's like for a day/week to have a condition that limited his riding and life in general. Would he use an ebike or quit riding?
I have read that people were saying that train will kill babies in their mother's womb during their introductions. I'm pretty amazed that he didn't use this axe of development.
On an interesting aspect, he maybe is the undoubtable proof that space travel exist?!! Directly from the 20th century's beginning!!!
PS: It's an "electRIC" bike.. not "electronic".. except if you consider that a bike with a speedo is one
Here's an analogy... Bikes come with shocks? Tell the little old lady you don't have the necessary shock rebuilding know-how for her poorly constructed contraption. Oh wait.. The industry has evolved so that any half competent shmo can change their own shock fluid?
The majority of bike mechanics not being competent with electrical work becomes economics. If customers have complicated repairs and there's a limited number of mechanics that can do it, that means that the few can charge a premium. BAM! Supply and demand.
Also what if in the next ten years, an electrically assisted mountain bike with six inches of travel weighs under 30 lbs?
TL : DR The author doesn't understand history, innovation or economics.
He is definitely that, but GOR's point is that as the tech grows and spreads the need to get them repaired will result in people filling that need.
I think everybody is generally against motorized vehicles on our trails for erosion/safety reasons but it will be interesting how that perception changes with a softer/quieter aspect of electric pedal assist.
Reading the comments though I am glad to see the article does not reflect on the greater mountain bike community. Most bikers seem to be more understanding and open minded.
You know, there are still places where the buzz of a fuel engine can and often do interrupt your otherwise peaceful bike ride... They're called enduro (yeah, enduro, see the irony?) motorcycles, the are loud, they stink, they destroy the trails, but they are allowed almost anywhere here, and where they're not they ride anyway cause nobody really cares.
So, I, for one, welcome our new electric motor overlords, if that means less noisy and stinky motors on the trails.
Says who? Of course this article is an opinion of one person however, it's a bit arrogant and narrow minded.
What is so bad about an eBike? Do you believe it's cheating? There are many people who don't race nor care to be the fastest and don't train and workout all the time.
If I'm a healthy young kid, young adult or older person and just want to go out (off road) to see nature and get lost on the trails just to ENJOY nature then an eBike is an option.
One can hike but there's no law against using a bike to do just that.
Also, there are people who are injured, have weaker lower backs. Messed up knees or joints where an assisted eBike may help.
There is a place for assisted bikes if there wasn't then companies would not be mass producing them.
As for the eBikes that are equipped to be made for DH purposes it would be nice to have an assisted pedal for going up the damn mountain so you can RIDE back down without the need to shuttle and waste MONEY and GAS.
If I couldn't shuttle where I lived I'd look at an E bike if they weren't so much $$$ and weight
Don't get me wrong tho, we don't need kids that are perfectly able to pedal to get an E-Bike and lazy their life away..
Minimum age of 14 years, and limited to 15mph with a 200w output motor, and the requirement to wear a helmet...
Don't really see an issue, if the roads and trails became cluttered with e-bikes you can bet the rules would change, and registration and licences would be required, the government wouldn't miss out on an earner that's for sure ;-)
The only thing that bothers me is why Enduro is written without an E on an E-Bike... trying to hide something? doesn't make any sense...
And as for the argument that it increases traffic on all the trails that are way out there and not shuttle-able, that's true but I always had the impression that a lot of those trails were originally horse or hiking trails? Bet those people had the same to say about us mountain bikers.
I've heard that some of the old, classic, steep trails up here in the Sea 2 Sky were originally trials motorbike trails. But now some people get mad when those guys continue to use them.
Maybe the energy that people devote towards degrading other people's bike/riding choices should be re-directed to trail sustainability and development that can sustain increased usage.
Mike, I normally really enjoy your articles, but this one is somewhat ridiculous. I have ridden with Bjorn (founder of Kranked e-bikes), as well as ridden one of his E-bikes, and it was a hell of a lot of fun. As he says, as he gets older, less fit, and his body breaks down (from years of intense riding himself), his e-bike has allowed him to venture further into the backcountry and (re)access trails with his younger, more fit riding buddies that he may otherwise have not been able to ride.
Again, I think the point we really need to take home is that maybe there needs to be more energy and advocacy towards trail sustainability and sustainable trail development, and less energy towards degrading what people ride and how they chose to access the trails and enjoy the outdoors in ways they may not otherwise be able to.
Now when I see a young fat ass with a beer or a a pack of cigarettes just motoring up the climbs I bust a lung on. That is entirely a different story.
- E-bikes are pointless for anyone with basic fitness. The addition of battery, motor etc. makes for a heavy bike and hampers handling.
- E-bikes can be great for older people and people with disabilities. There is an 80+ year old Austrian guy that designs and builds uber light e-bikes and goes on great epic rides on them (can't find the link - if anyone else knows what I'm talking about please post a link). Say what you will but this guy can ride an e-bike and be freacking cool at the same time.
TLDR version: E-bikes are good for older people/ people with disabilities. E-bikes are pretty much useless for persons with normal fitness.
"I HAVE NEVER RIDDEN ONE AND HAVE NO IDEA"
and saved all that waffle!
my rides are 70% up the hill, i get to go more runs with the ebike i have lots more action and absolutely lots more work out....im NOT LAZY and NOT FAT i just love Enduro activity as much as everyone that reading pinkbik.com, i do ride dirt jump and free ride bikes without motor and get the same joy of ride. i don't see it in the feature becoming big, the DH or Enduro ebike that getting develop by the big names are way too expensive and it wont get cheaper. my built-up came up to $1600 with all new components except for the frame (Azonic Eliminator 2004- $240 on ebay) since its just experiment. im looking to get a newer and better DH frame in the near future....but no worries ill be riding my other bikes as well...
E-bikes CAN be used in areas where signs posted state "no motorized vehicles allowed." Almost all of those signs will have a Vehicle Code (VC) or Municipal Code (MC) posted at the bottom which defines the restrictions. Almost all the time "no motorized vehicles" refers to liquid fuel internal combustion vehicles that require licensing to legally operate. According to CVC, an e-bike doesn't require licensing and is not a motor vehicle.
V C Section 24016 Motorized Bicycle Electric Motor Safety and Equipment Requirements
Motorized Bicycle Electric Motor: Safety and Equipment Requirements
24016. (a) A motorized bicycle described in subdivision (b) of Section 406 shall meet the following criteria:
(b) All of the following apply to a motorized bicycle described in subdivision (b) of Section 406:
(1) No person shall operate a motorized bicycle unless the person is wearing a properly fitted and fastened bicycle helmet that meets the standards described in Section 21212.
(2) A person operating a motorized bicycle is subject to Sections 21200 and 21200.5.
(3) A person operating a motorized bicycle is not subject to the provisions of this code relating to financial responsibility, driver's licenses, registration, and license plate requirements, and a motorized bicycle is not a motor vehicle.
(4) A motorized bicycle shall only be operated by a person 16 years of age or older.
(5) Every manufacturer of a motorized bicycle shall certify that it complies with the equipment and manufacturing requirements for bicycles adopted by the Consumer Product Safety Commission (16 C.F.R. 1512.1, et seq.).
(c) No person shall tamper with or modify a motorized bicycle described in subdivision (b) of Section 406 so as to increase the speed capability of the bicycle.
www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc24016.htm
I didnt even know these existed until this article, other than the one ronnie renner rips around on which looks alot more heavy duty
I went around Cannock Chase on an Nduro Pro last weekend!
I got looks of disgust as I DESTROYED people up the climbs!
Fact of the matter is... they were spinning their pussy rings with 200rpm through the cranks and I was hyper-ventilating due to the effort I was putting in, being blinded by my own sweat! The fact I had a motor just made me do it faster!!
So while they were being self rightous spinning their ridiculous 32 to 40 "enduro" drive trains, crawling round the trail, I was having a coffee!
I guess the hatred is expected much like 29 vs 650b. 35mm bars is better, enduro vs everything else. It's no surprise there would be hatred for e bikes. Personally I wouldn't own one but I'm not going to be offended if I see someone cruising past me on one. I guess PB and it's writers are going to endorse what they like and ridicule what they don't. In my opinion it's not what mountain biking is about. We should welcome innovation and technology into this sport. If not we should all still be riding hardtails on 60mm coil spring pogo forks, pedals with toe straps and archaic frame designs.
The comment about tearing up the local trails is laughable I couldn't tell you how many mountain bikers I see altering or destroying trails, braking through berms removing rock sections because it doesn't suit their riding abilities or they feel they can do whatever they want. I see some mountain bikers disrespect hikers and other trail users. Sometimes we are our own worst enemies and cause areas to be shut down because of our actions.
Just go ride YOUR bike.. don't worry about what other people are doing. Be respectful to others on the trails. It really is that simple.
Most ebikes can be easily pedaled out of "the back country" or is it that you only have the ability to pedal a bike that weighs no more than a box of matches?
wanker
2 / do all mountain
In the first case, I think that might be a good excuse to reorganize ascents.
In the second, however, I think that should not exist.
A friend of mine has just bought hibike posted above but 'already' been excluded from the group Sunday bike.
2 / do all mountain
In the first case, I think that might be a good excuse to reorganize ascents.
In the second, however, I think that should not exist.
A friend of mine has just bought hibike posted above but 'already' been excluded from the group Sunday bike.
krankedbikes.com/kustoms
So I would say: PLASE BE INFORMED ON WHAT YOU ARE WRITING ABOUT AND ON THE SUBJECT OF THE PICTURES YOU USE, that is not the case.
Beware guys, from people dividing you into categories forced to be one against the other, from people having uncontrollable fears, that would divide the world in black and white things, always pointing fingers to whatever is different......
Open your minds.....we are talking about human vehicles not bikes alone, Ok, you don't consider an e-bike a bicycle? good for you....but when you say that they are only useful for a little old lady.....well, I would say: c'mon on nxt EUROBIKE, you are welcome to try my bike....at least you can agree that it is better to keep these 10+Hp x 25Kg out from any little old lady....
I'm an MX and an MTB rider, but that thing is different, you'll not be able to put it into any category, that's the fun, think about a 2wheel that is powerful as a light dirtbike, but is only 25-30Kg (range dependent), that cost you nothing in gas, that is clean for the sphere and for your hands, that you may lift upstairs, and that you may service yourself like a bike in your living room or garage....finally add that you may pedal and maintain it at 25Kph no problem and you have an idea of what is an extreme of an electric-motor-bike-cycle. It would never like to be called a bicycle while flying by motor....but, still, it is that....even for you, Mike, at least without motor and batteries....
They stop no different to a downhill bike... 25kg ebike with a 75kg rider... comparable to an 18kg DH bike with an 82kg rider. both feasible combinations...
It doesn't matter what bike you are riding when you use a death grip! Its dangerous whatever! It seems kids these days ride BMXs with no brakes at all, surely that is more dangerous than an ebike with few extra (strategically placed) kilos!
I though it was a fun pastime for all kinds of people in all shapes and sizes from all walks of life.
I don't see how my love of cake pies and beer diminishes my love of bikes.
2. Go to Europe.
Still, nailing DH on a MTB gives you a anaerobic workout which presumably you would be able to do more times in a day on a e-bike, still better than sitting at a computer all day
27.5ers - cool
29ers - dorky
E-bikes - for lazy motherf*ckers who don't understand the concept of a human powered mode of transportation that enables our mind/body to sync up on the trail.
Phuck e bikes
www.pinkbike.com/video/393503
The western world is overrun with obesity. People need an access point to start getting more active. This is a step in the right direction!
Give them a meatjacket and release the hounds. That'll help them.
1) I don't need the acceptance or permission of a person/group of people to have an opinion about them
2) I don't need any sort of qualification to suggest/advise that a high quantity of very sugary baked goods is not good for an overweight person
3) I have heard that phrase, often from people who require an experts permission or advice in order to employ common sense. The second half of 3) is not totally clear so I'm not referring to it.
Is this better?
I know more than you may think about nutrition, obviously 'donuts', as a figurative example, is not to be taken as part of a dietary plan for every person. But if you need me to tell you that maybe I should start at the beginning again. I'm enjoying locking horns with you, none of it is personal ofcourse.
On the subject of them putting up with comments and stigma, they obviously weren't bad enough to make them sort it out. And whatever doesn't kill you only makes you stronger. I've never been fat, but trust me, fat people aren't the only people who get given shit. I put up with shit all through school and beyond. And it only bothered me on the odd occassion it was true. If more people were black and white about the subject (eg: replying 'yes, you're getting fat' instead of 'you look fine') we wouldn't have anywhere near the obesity problem we do. So herein lies the question, are you doing your friend a favour by being quiet about his enormous gut, or are you doing them an injustice? People are free to be however light or heavy they like but don't expect special treatment or sympathy.
P.s. being able to eat donuts and still shred is totally possible. I wasn't addressing their bike skills. I also referenced 'fat' people because that was the reference point within this thread, for people who shouldn't own an ebike. I think that's common sense though, if you're overweight you definitely don't need assistance.. you need a kick up the ASSistance.