Cascade Components Announces Transition Sentinel and Patrol Linkage

 hahahha thats awesome. Looks like Commencal really does need a copywriter.

 Yes, correct. I think this speaks highly for Transition and was a deciding factor for me to purchase the link.

 This needs to be higher. Transition stepped up here when they really didn't need to.

 @caribooyj: I'm hoping kona does the same thing for their one

 Same story. Soooooooo much pittage.

 @idrinkpabst: I just made a similar change by going to a Float X2, and running a bit less sag, full air tokens, and fully open high-speed compression. I'm sure this link does an even better job!

 I've added this link to my Carbon Sentinel with a Push 11/6 shock. Best upgrade I've ever done to a bike. I almost regretted trading my Patrol for the Sentinel for the first year of riding, was going back to a Patrol next year, but now have the best of both bikes.

The bike is so much more fun and playful, lost nothing on the climb (Two days ago I did a 3,000m climb, 54+kms of climbing and descending on black diamond trails).

This link is worth every penny and I highly recommend the upgrade. I'm loving it.

www.pinkbike.com/photo/18921660

 Do you still use the same shock with a 205 x 57.5 size?

 @taurausmountain: I do. I thought I'd have to make adjustments, but so far it works so well, no need for change.

 You'd think transition would've made a link that works in the first place withh the amount of people on here waxing lyrical about them. Seems like it's mostly marketing.

 @idrinkpabst: Ok bro, I know some slang but WTF is getting pitted?!

 @Riwajc: The Sentinel was a HUGE improvement over the Smuggler, and rode like a nimble DH bike, smashing down trails. Everyone was pretty clear from the start that it had a pretty linear rate, and thus lacked small-bump/initial stroke sensitivity.

 @taurausmountain: yes you can use the stock shock and it is a noticeable improvement. Keeps the bike relevant and not forced to go carbon yet.

 @caribooyj: your bike looks sick with that silver combo! I put the black version on mine. It turns the bike into a completely different beast. I'm stoked!

 @TW80: a deep tube ride

 @TW80: This is all you need to know: youtu.be/n-5F_7DwPpo

 @Riwajc: Don't you like having options? Or endless things to spend your money on? Come on.

 Question for my fellow v1 owners: has anyone tried a 32 or even a 34 tooth chain ring on theirs? Transition website says a 34 will fit (on the AL version). I want higher gearing, but I just want to make sure it doesn't mess up the kinematics.

 @kcy4130: I have been running a 32 since day one. Plenty of clearance. I am sure a 34 would fit.

 @Riwajc: I do think a lot of these aftermarket links are mostly marketing (particularly the Santa Cruz ones that don't change the suspension curve very drastically), but in the case of the Sentinel and Stumpjumper, they fix a real problem on the bike.

 @kcy4130: Been running a 34T on my v1 AL Sentinel for the past 1.5 yrs and no issues to report beyond the fitness requirements to push it

 @Machodiesel: and @garrisond5 Good to know, thank you.

 @kcy4130: a bigger chainring will lower your Anti-Squat as far I know. That means less Pedal-Kickback, which is quite nice on the downs.

 @TW80: Getting Pitted!!! A must Watch www.youtube.com/watch?v=akmQ7NRl0QU

 @CobyCobie: If it's not the real deal we don't make it theloamwolf.com/2020/02/17/review-cascade-components-v4-nomad-lt-link

 @CobyCobie: Someone's been hitting a massive 45' stepdown at my local trails on a CC linked Hightower. I don't think that's marketing

 @idrinkpabst: If it's a tan hightower w/ a black bomber, it's probably the cascade man himself, he rips the big boy features at snoqualmie

 @Tracefunction @idrinkpabst: Yup that's Jimmy, he's an absolute shredder. Have seen him hit the 45'er and it's the smoothest I've ever seen anyone land it. I didn't even hear him land!

Definitely not just marketing. I have a Nomad and Sentinel both. The change was more drastic on the Sentinel in terms of progression, but it was very noticeable on the Nomad as well (have spent a lot of time on both with stock shocks/stock links and stock shocks/cascade links).

Agreed your average Blues/Black rider probably wouldn't notice (and these stock bikes are likely optimized for that market), but for expert level riders looking to find the balance of progression for fast chunder and BIG features, Cascade link is a fantastic option.

 @CascadeComponents: Fair enough. I love my Sentinel link. I do think some bikes need revised kinematics more than others. If you want more travel though your links are awesome. Keep doing what you're doing!

 I am curious what level of pitting there is to start?

 @onemind123: no less than 1

 @onemind123: If you know, you know.

 It's 800% points more.....not 800% more.

 @watchmen: Who are you? SRAM?

 ..

 Specialized does this as well.... 95% of their market ride blue and green trails.

 I'm wondering the same.
The guys at Tansition seem to be damn good at their jobs. But maybe it's much easier to develop something like this with a couple of months worth of feedback from a much bigger audience than just the prelminary product testers?

 @jaydawg69: Ding ding ding.

 I am not certain, and correct me if I am wrong, but it seems like this link will make the v1 Sentinel similar to the v2 Sentinel that was just released. I do have to agree with everyone else commenting on how this really changes the bike. It is like some kind of witch craft or something!

 I think it has to do with how Transition likes their bikes to ride, and what they ride. The stock bike set-up the way they suggest (30-33% sag, tons of LSC, fast/light rebound) gives the bike a firm, poppy platform-ey back end. This makes it energetic and playful on rollers and smooth jumps and side hits and stuff. You can boost off of basically nothing, and turn a boring trail in to a fun trail. Basically, it rides like a plush and forgiving hardtail.

That setup isn't for everything though. It isn't designed for plowing through chunk, dropping to flat, carrying speed through the rough. That's not what the bike was designed to do, but this link turns it in to a bike that can do that stuff much more confidently.

At least with my current setup on this link, the bike is definitely less poppy and jibby. The back end is more active and glued to the ground. It's super supple near full droop, and doesn't have as much of that snap that encourages the cheeky bunny hop over the thing you'd normally plow over or ride around. I bet you could get some of that snap back with more LSC, but it'd just make the bike worse IMO

tl;dr it depends on your priorities. If you want to plow and make bad decisions, this link will help.

 Maybe at the time they thought they got the design right? Are companies not allowed to learn and improve? Kinda seems the way things normally go, why shit on Transition? I agree with you to some degree in that testing could have revealed the need to add more progression, but i also recall the bike getting rave reviews, and they did originally design it around an air shock.

 @ripcraft: Totally. I certainly bought one after a test-ride in Bellingham. It's a good bike, and the SBG geometry was the thing that wowed me enough to buy one on the spot. The back-end works, and especially works well on Bham's flowy trails. It's just not equipped for the kind of riding style and terrain that I'm in to these days, and for that I'm psyched that the new link is an option.

 @wubbalubbadubdub: this sounds correct to me...dont own the frame, but have one of my bikes setup similarly. Pretty hard rear to make it poppy and fun, but seems to break through into its travel on landings. So much fun to ride, but different from my other bikes that seem to more easily contour to the ground and stat planted. I like both, but that one is special.

 When I called transition and asked them about shock changes to help with bottoming out (Had to run really really high pressure with lots of compression) they directed me to cascade components for this product. Its has been great so far. I have the alloy so travel increase went from 140 to 148 with the stock shock. But I don't notice or care about 8mm its the progression I wanted and the progression I got!

 @climblikeatoad: or pro athletes that weigh155 lbs instead of 200+

 That same hypothetical question could be asked about Fox, RockShox, or any other top suspension company when there is Push, Vorsprung, and other performance suspension companies.

 @jaydawg69: Heeey, i've got a Transition and... yeah, fairplay, i favour the blues (at the bike park at least anyway).

The irony being that my Transition is in TR blue.

Talk about wearing your heart on your sleeve (or your gravity cowardice on your bike).

In my defence i had no intention of owning something so boosh-tacular, but it was on sale at a wallet-flappingly insane giscount

 username checks out.

 @bikeskibikeski: Doesn't count. My trail-cowardice was pre-advertised.

 If you don't feel like you need it, you probably don't need it.

For me the link was the perfect solution to get the right progression I needed on big jumps/features with huge compression while still maintaining suppleness through the fast rough stuff. I'm also 200 lbs, so a larger rider as well which also makes a difference.

 @robotdave: Thanks dude. I was just curious about it as i don't really understand the suspension shennanigans. Looking at the levers and dials on on my fork and shock is like looking at a mixing desk in a recording studio. Since i got a super-sweet spec with my bike (more than i need but the bike was on sale for pretty much what i budgeted for a decent entry level bike), i really should learn how to get the most out of it.

Although i can nearly manual now, so it doesn't seem completely unreasonable that i may do Hardline or Rampage soon.

 Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but here's my understanding. A leverage rate or 3 means for every 1mm the shock moves, the rear end moves 3mm. Therefore at a higher leverage rate, the shock will move less relative to the rear end than at a lower leverage rate. That means at a higher leverage rate, it will take less force to compress the shock. A progressive leverage rate will require more force to move the same amount of travel at the end of the travel than at the beginning.

 @mtb-sf: That was what I was wondering. Except when you say "at a higher leverage rate the shock will move less relative...." isn't that actually what happens at the lower leverage rate? That is leverage rate of 2 is less leverage (therefore harder to move, more force required) than a leverage of 3 (easier to move with less force)?

 Leverage ratio is a multiplier that, as used in the bike industry, is how many times more force is applied to shock than the wheel and how many times more the wheel moves than the shock. For me it's easiest to think of it as the impact that's felt at the wheel though. For a leverage ratio of 3 the force at the wheel is 1/3 the force the shock is exerting and the wheel is moving 3 times faster than the shock. Then if you switch the leverage ratio to 2 the force at the wheel is 1/2 the force at the shock and the wheel is moving 2 times faster than the shock. Also if you integrate the leverage curve over the stroke of the shock you get the total amount of travel the bike has.

As for progressive vs linear suspension and such, the leverage curve is really about what it buys you set up wise. The easiest impact to visualize is a drop to flat. Lets say you want your suspension to use exactly the stroke of the shock for this impact no more no less. The amount of energy it has to absorb is your potential energy on top of the drop (m*g*h). This energy is divided between energy stored in the spring and energy dissipated by the damper. The sum of those two is equal to your potential energy. Now another assumption for this is both bikes have the same sag percent at the wheel. The linear bike will run a lower spring rate to achieve its sag point than the more progressive bike.The amount of energy stored in a spring is proportional to the spring constant so the linear bike will store less energy in the spring than the progressive bike. This means to absorb the potential energy from that drop to flat it has to dissipate more energy through damping. Higher damping force makes it harder for the suspension to respond to high frequency high velocity impacts (roots and rocks). Essentially you can have an obstacle that only requires the wheel to move a small amount to roll over than creates a sudden spike in shock speed and in turn a sudden spike in shock force which prevents the wheel from moving out of the way as much. By making a bike more progressive not only can you increase bottom out resistance, but you can alter that damping/spring energy equation to allow the suspension to remain more active over things like roots and rocks. There's more to it than a drop to flat, but the same general principles play into everything. The one other big factor for successive hits while you are on the ground is the amount of shock stroke available before bottom out from the sag point. A more progressive bike actually has a little more stroke available before bottom out because 30% sag at the wheel will be less than 30% at the shock for that bike.

Long winded, but that about sums it up.

 @CascadeComponents: Will you guys be making one for the Smuggler as well? This sounds like exactly what I am looking for on my frame.

 @n8dawg82: I fully agree on this. @CascadeComponents please throw us smuggler folks a bone!

 @CascadeComponents: Given that do you recommend changing amount of sag being run when going to a more progressive link like yours?

 I totally wonder that about all the links for that matter. I'm guessing it is easier to go back and engineer a single part as an improvement...than designing it 'ideally' the first time as a complete suspension system. Either that or maybe more progression isn't always seen as ideal for the average rider. I do have one on my megatower.

 generally within suspension, making the design "better" in one place will make it "worse" in another. Like frames with very high antisquat also having pedal kickback issues. Suspension that is too progressive can lead to not having enough support and sitting relatively low in the travel despite having proper air pressure (or spring rate) and damping performance.

It's always a tradeoff, and depending on what kind of rider you are, this link may make your Transition sentinel worse. If progressive suspension is something you value, like hucking big stuff or if you like soft-off-the-top suspension then It's likely to make your experience better.

 Sag is supposed to be set with you in a centered attack position over the bike. So standing up and not sitting down. Seat angle should be irrelevant in that scenario.

 @NebulousNate: Transition actually recommends setting sag sitting on the seat with no weight on the bars, which is unusual.

 It depends on frame tolerances and such. You'd definitely want to test it with your frame first.

 I've tried a 62.5 on a Large 19 Sentinel with EXT shock. Resivour contacts down tube and seat stay arch would contact under full bottom out on mine. A few people said they've been using 62.5 without a problem, mine may just have clearance issue...

 @bricknall: Did you try it at 60mm. I've heard some frames even have clearance issues at 60mm.

 I have a 2019 Carbon in large. I removed the 2.5mm spacer so now have 205x60. Mine appears to have probably had enough clearance to have removed the 5mm. I cheated and just cut the spacer out. I decided sticking to just removing the 2.5mm spacer was a safe bet. That got me from 140-152mm travel, according to Cascade. I figure paired with the 170mm Lyric I just put on there, it stays with a similar feel to the stock 140/160 set up. Only one ride so far as I just installed late last week. So far so good. Just gotta keep honing in on the proper set up. An improvement for sure though.

 I have the new Sentinel and I'm running a DVO 62.5 and works perfectly. I'm looking forward to picking up this new linkage.

 @bricknall: I'm running 62.5 on my 2020 Sentinel v2 on a medium frame and it works great.

 @bjjfighter: The CC linkage is for the v1 sentinel.

 Nah not at all. I run a Cascade link on my own bike, and you don't have to be riding at WC speeds to feel the difference. Just bouncing up and down on the bike is enough to notice the difference in feel. Carbon rims and bars on the other hand...

 Thanks for weighing in on something you admit yourself, you know nothing about. The guys that ride a Sentinel like myself, always appreciate an uninformed opinion. Cheers!

 Black is already backordered. Went with Blue. I've been running the suspension on my Patrol super hard so that I had the support I like. This sounds like just the way to make it so I can run softer pressure and get more small bump sensitivity while still having the support I need.

 Took it out for the first test ride today. Got a PR on my favorite trail that I use as a test track. I wound up dropping about 20psi after just riding it around my driveway. On the trail, it felt more supple and also had a much more bottomless feeling. I also did not need to use the climb switch and it felt like there was more support on the climbs.

 Nope!

 This is for the V1. Here's mine:
www.pinkbike.com/photo/18921660