Just so y'all know, the video wasn't made to prove that 29ers are better for freeriding or dirtjumping or anything, but just that the tradeoff from 26" wheels isn't THAT big a deal.
And it's funny that all the dirt jump kids on 26" wheels are talking about how 29" wheels look big and awkward on dirt jumps. psst, I think bmxers have something to say to you.
Hey I wouldn't hate on them too hard because I'm pretty sure none of them have ridden a 29er or even XC for that matter which is really where 29s shine. Regarding everything else said, people need to chill and brian, great points.
brian amazing points, i know im young and not too experienced but ive tried to ride a 24 or a 26 bike and i gotta say its damn difficult for me, seeing this i have a whole new respect if i can see a guy shredding with a bigger bike i say go right ahead its all about preference maybe some people think 26 might be too small for them if the market wants to start a 29er DH/FR bike trend go for it but they better hope they get it right
Hey Brianpark, perhaps you can share with us your credentials.
Because by the Look of that contraption that you call your bike, Man , you really need help, I mean Profesional help!
Another Clown that is a nobody in the bike industry!
@enrico650, are you talking about the bike in the video? I dunno, I thought it was a pretty cool idea. Or are you talking about my around town bike in this album: www.pinkbike.com/photo/6115705 ? I'm not really sure what it has anything to do with, but hey, you don't have to like it.
And I'm not sure why you're so into credentials either, but hey: I've been working in shops for 11+ years now, do a little media/web work in the industry here and there (like the vid above), and generally have a good time.
No man, really where are they? All I'm seeing are some family videos filled with crappy editing, quality and mediocre trail riding. Seems like someone is hyping themselves up a tad because they made a few youtube edits for a local bike shop... Mr. "industry" man. No one that's really involved with the mountain bike industry would act the way you are. Stop pretending and hating on people.
You have to make them like that, so 20 year old punks riding rocky mountain bikes save money and purchase real bikes. Tell you what, I have spare 2011 bikes that i can sell you for cheap. We have to give back to the comunity, and to those that don`t have talent or money.
It's just awesome to see some xc riding on Pinkbike. I think most users think that there's only DH, DJ or FR in the mountain biking world. But awesome riding and obviously not like normal XC riding
It's not a matter of iPhone or Androir or WP7... Its about keeping up with the new (not so new) web development standart. HTML5 means no extra plugins and a gazillion times faster browsing. Androids are alright tho..
a thing is: 29er is more efficient, can carry speed over the corners better, the only flaw is the acceleration - that's it! Most of all it makes easy to go over obstacles, stones, roots, mud pools. The question is: aren't these why we ride mountain bikes for?
A road bike as we know it today, it's evolution was driven by the quest for ultimate performance. The result is a super efficient machine, way faster than other bikes with similar purpose like a trekking bike. The question I ask is, whether road bike with it's geometry allows you to do anything else than look few meters ahead and pedal? Your wrists hurt, back hurt, neck hurt when you look around too much. Well i thought that a great thing about road biking is that you ride through villages, countryside. You enjoy being there, seeing all this non urban landscape, seeing stuff you don't see everyday, mean smell of cow shit is so rare these days, that I damn enjoy it...
It's like building a lift to MtEverest... cool to be there, but, is it the same as really climbing it? wasn't the hardship of climbing THE original purpose of all of it?
The thing about them being more efficient really depends on the riding you do.. sure you can carry more speed and all, but it really only shows if you're able to be out there (like on a road bike) for sustained amounts of time and not if you're starting/stopping a lot. If you're starting/stopping a lot, they do have more rotational mass that you need to get moving up to speed.
also feels a lot less good in the corners, and coming from a place where all the trails maximise the use of the land they have they're all tight and sharp corners, tricky on a 29er
Dannnnggggg, what's with all the big wheel hate? I've never ridden a 29er except around a parking lot, but if that's what people want to ride, let'em. Nothing wrong with having some options. I doubt they flood the freeride market, but if some XC cats want to pedal some bigger wheels in the woods, that's cool with me.
for xc 29ers make sense, but i would stop at xc. 60% of the bikes sold now into the xc market are 29ers, you see a lot of them at the races. so for parts and trading with your buddies is getting easy because there are a lot of parts out there right now for xc, freeride, dh, not so much. i still race on a 26er and i like it, the handling is superior to a 29er and thats why i choose 26.
First off, great skills! Nice vid. Loved it. Wish I had the skills to either ride like that or film like that. Well done guys.
As for the 29er debate that this has turned into.... really, for the love of bikes, it shouldn't matter!!
I have a bike shed full of bits; all for 26inch wheel based framesets. I have a bank account with not much money in it and a family to support. I love getting out riding and when I am lucky enough to have the time for a ride, I go.
Add the above three together and I personally don't have the need to get into 29ers. Everyone can do their own maths.
As long as each and every one of us knows why we are buying any frame/wheelset/fork, that is all that matters. Get on a bike. Any bike. Ride and enjoy!
Its a bike, embrace it with all your heart because we love them thats why we come here
I really dont care what size wheels you have, i ride DH/FR/XC/AM whatever label the marketeers what to call "mountbiking" next on 24" and 26" rims and if i could afford a full 29ER i would get one because its a bike and i love them and this is how everyone should be.
Those big ol' goofy-looking wheels are starting to grow on me. I've not ridden a 29er yet, so all I have is pure prejudice as a frame of reference. From a strictly aesthetic stand-point, I still prefer 26-inch rigs. So what's next? Easy. I need to find a terminally ill old lady who is willing to leave her entire estate to me, the Bentley, the Learjet 60 XR, the castle and all -- p!ssing off her hateful relatives, of course -- so that I can then condone forking out the snappers for a twenty-nine inch plaything. Why can I not afford everything I want? Goddamn it. *Smile.*
The worst part about all these 29ers starting to look so good is it’s another damn bike I want. It’s terrible to be the guy that enjoys all the different types of riding. I currently want 3 or 4 new bikes! Addiction kids it's hard to live with.
Dont give a monkeys if i get bashed, but 29 is just a fad to me, that will hopefully pass. Working in a bike shop, I can say, the majority are still designed as if they were 26, that is, as if normal frame fitted on big wheels... Stupid clearances, weird handling.. WHY OH WHY? Thats like doing road races with 26" (lets start to find advantages for it). Its just an unnecessary monstrosity. People will start coming up with reasons, like, oh yeah, it rolls over stuff easier, well, pedal harder and you will find that just about any wheel size will roll over stuff just easy enough.
I can see its places though. Grandpa style singletrack or off roading touring...
i can't find the link currently, but Cristophe Sauser did some time trial type testing down here in SA on a specialized XC full suspension in the 2 different wheel sizes, he did timed runs ascending and descending and was faster both ways on the 29er, personally I like the compact feel of a 26er and if i really was an all out race snake then maybe a 29er but I also think it's just shrewed marketing again, Gary Fisher's always been a shrewed little bugger and a marketer through and through. besides which seems easier to manual? and that's why i go out on a trail to have ripping fun, not be a fast effecient race snake (already am anyway)
Awesome concept! I don't see the 29er taking off in the DH scene but for bikes that are made to do more then just go down your fav. mountain side, 29 inch wheels rock. All the "die-hard" DH guy's probably don't have to worry about their 26" wheels becoming extinct any time soon, lol.
Great concept! The 29" wheel is not just for riding down hills all day long, it is made for climbing those mountains and descending back down just like the 26" wheel but with more control. I don't think "die hard" down hill guys will have to worry about getting a 29er any time soon, lol. I ride both and love both because they are both bikes..........or maybe because I don't give a shiaht :-)
Then don't be such an idiot. Theoretically a 29" wheel should have more contact surface with the ground in a corner because of the larger diameter. Now, pushing a bigger wheel through a corner can be harder, but you hardly "lose all control with the ground."
90% of Pinkbike rides 26" wheels on jumps that would be better on a 20" wheel. I think what I'm trying to say... is shut the f*ck up and ride your bike.
@ brian, you should learn how to discuss a thread and not call people idiots an shut the f*ck up.. In my eyes 20"" bmx - 26'' mtb - 29'' road bikes.. i'ts my right to post a comment on this subject and what i'm trying to say is when you ride 29" you're just like a truck running over the trails instead of riding them with skills..
mentalz i think you need to calm down, Perhaps get a life. First of all road wheels are not 29inches and 29er mountain bikes do not give any rider amazing skill they just provide a bike that will actually fit tall riders. If your fairly short in my oppinion you should keep riding 26inch wheels. If your tall and you want a bike to fit try out a 29er. The industry is not pushing 29ers on every one there simply trying to improve problem points on mountain bikes. Are you going to start saying that riders are not allowed to ride certain size frames because it makes riding to easy? Oh and go f*ck yourself.
hahaha.. i geuss brian is getting his friends to sort out his problems on forums.. 29" INCHES OF SHIT that's what i call it tall ass mofos... f*ck u and goodbye!
Sweet riding--29er or not, with skinny XC tires in the mud! In my cycling experience, when the majority violently dislikes something they have yet to experience, it always marks the beginning of a revolution. But the 29er won't be able to play in the 26-inch FR DH sandbox using off-the-shelf thinking and made-for-26-inch components. Big-wheel designers will have to come up with 29er-specific innovations to address its long-travel shortcomings, like: eliminating most of the seat tube to make room for suspension travel, shortening chainstay lengths while making room for 3.4" tires, wider chain-lines, carbon fiber FR-width rims, wide-spaced hub flanges and over-sized, through-axle rear hubs. Until then; long-travel 26er big-bikes will be relatively unchallenged.
The intense "2951," albeit not totally there, brings it that much closer. Edge/Enve makes a heavy duty carbon 29er rim, WTB makes a more affordable "FR" alloy one as well.
Some bmx riders are gonna hate on 26", and 26" riders are gonna hate on the 29" riders regardlessly
There's pros and cons to any wheel size. Innovation just makes the sandbox smaller. Better equipment and technology just lessens the challenge of a trail, forcing one to build more challenging trails. I believe you said something similar in one of your articles Richard, regarding trail riding on your SS Redline on trails you typically would ride your 5" bike on; if memory serves correctly, which would be a surprise. (article was from 05/06 I believe)
Yes, there are pros and cons to any wheel size, material, suspension design and so forth. I own a fully rigid 29er that serves the purpose of XC riding, multi-purpose (road, goose, etc.) and works well for many trails that are not too technical because of its weight and efficiency. I adopted 29ers long before they were mass market and popular; my friends used to say it's a passing fad. Well, after many years, it's here to stay. Capitalist economies of scale, "innovation" or whatever. I never thought we'd see 29ers on the World Cup XC circuit.
Personal anecdote. When I researched a bike for BC and the kind of trails here, I debated for a long time about whether to choose a 4" travel 29er or a longer travel 26er - which bike would provide more fun, comfort and performance? I ultimately decided on a 26" bike with 5/6" travel. The logic has to do with geometry changes for a 29er with more than 4" of travel combined with the handling/fun factor. I guess if I had to have only one bike to do everything, I might be inclined to go for a 4" travel 29er and live with it. Then again, I'm not a super aggressive, big air, hyper speed downhiller. Personal tastes, where you ride and skill level are probably the best criteria to decide which bike is best for you.
I'm riding Enve composite 29er wheels and they are nearly indestructible. I had a Niner RIP and it was pretty sweet down technical stuff, and for most rough and rocky-ledge terrain it is as good as a 6-inch 26er. Where a shorter-travel big-wheel bike comes up short, is when you have to land flat--then four measly inches of suspension feels like four measly inches. That's when wheel size really doesn't matter.
heh they are the future as long as people buy them. It's totaly stupid, 29ers are on the market for couple of years and there was no shortage of them from various smaller companies. Big guys came into a trouble in the meantime though - they've run out of ideas for developing XC bikes further. As soon as carbon fiber wheels came in, the development got stuck as it's pretty hard to make something "faster and better" - CF frames are pushed to the weight/strength limits already, hard to invent something new with components, it 15mm axle "standard" is here for good anyways - they were fu**ed. So they started doing 29ers... Specialized R&D chief in interveiw for cycling news said that niners are the future at least in XC racing heh - he wasn't interviewed, he was making sure his stuff will sell.
Origin of that crap lies in Specializeds doctrine statement which is pretty much common for all others: "Innovate or die". It is simply a result of typical capitalistic and neoliberal principles of 1. We need to be the best 2.We need to grow 3.To grow we constantly need new stuff". All world works like that nobody even thinks to question it. Lots of uncritical self confidence with lack of following discussion 1.What good does it do to be the best, best in what? 2.why to grow, when is it enough, 3 And does new stuff actualy help, and if so, helps in what and whom? Ultimately: why one must die from staying where he is and with what he has, and what do they mean by innovation.
I honestly see no problem with a little bit of progression. I don't jump on to every new trend/standard in the industry. I just like 29ers. That being said, i probably won't buy one for a while because the prices will be ridiculous.
So 29er is pretty much a good niche idea that has been blown by big business instead of staying where it should be. And now trails will be full of same weekend warriors (as this is the target group) than can ride this little bit faster, and feel this little bit closer to Sausser or Hill. If they couldn't execute fundamental trail riding skills on 26er, like lifting the front wheel and goig over the obstacles, now they are definitely not going to learn it any faster if at all. Niners front end is harder to pull up, and with that easiness of going through all like a truck, a poor rider will loose any will to pull this wheel up at all. Stomping and being decelerated by unweighed obstacles he's gonna be exactly where he is now just developing his bad habits... maybe innovatin new ones...
well than thats the rider's fault for falling for a marketing scheme. However, those of us who ride frequently and would like to add a 29er to our collection will enjoy them.
I would like a 29er ss rigid to commute and play on when I have time between classes. Seems like a good trade off: convenience for commuting, but some trail capability. If I were rich I'd prolly buy a supper sick FS 29er just because it might be fun to try, but I like what I've got considering my funds.
And it's funny that all the dirt jump kids on 26" wheels are talking about how 29" wheels look big and awkward on dirt jumps. psst, I think bmxers have something to say to you.
And I'm not sure why you're so into credentials either, but hey: I've been working in shops for 11+ years now, do a little media/web work in the industry here and there (like the vid above), and generally have a good time.
So, 11 years, Where?
Tell you what, I have spare 2011 bikes that i can sell you for cheap.
We have to give back to the comunity, and to those that don`t have talent or money.
Wicked little edit.
HTML5 means no extra plugins and a gazillion times faster browsing. Androids are alright tho..
A road bike as we know it today, it's evolution was driven by the quest for ultimate performance. The result is a super efficient machine, way faster than other bikes with similar purpose like a trekking bike. The question I ask is, whether road bike with it's geometry allows you to do anything else than look few meters ahead and pedal? Your wrists hurt, back hurt, neck hurt when you look around too much. Well i thought that a great thing about road biking is that you ride through villages, countryside. You enjoy being there, seeing all this non urban landscape, seeing stuff you don't see everyday, mean smell of cow shit is so rare these days, that I damn enjoy it...
It's like building a lift to MtEverest... cool to be there, but, is it the same as really climbing it? wasn't the hardship of climbing THE original purpose of all of it?
As for the 29er debate that this has turned into.... really, for the love of bikes, it shouldn't matter!!
I have a bike shed full of bits; all for 26inch wheel based framesets.
I have a bank account with not much money in it and a family to support.
I love getting out riding and when I am lucky enough to have the time for a ride, I go.
Add the above three together and I personally don't have the need to get into 29ers. Everyone can do their own maths.
As long as each and every one of us knows why we are buying any frame/wheelset/fork, that is all that matters.
Get on a bike. Any bike. Ride and enjoy!
I really dont care what size wheels you have, i ride DH/FR/XC/AM whatever label the marketeers what to call "mountbiking" next on 24" and 26" rims and if i could afford a full 29ER i would get one because its a bike and i love them and this is how everyone should be.
Lifes too short go live it.
I can see its places though. Grandpa style singletrack or off roading touring...
Cool video though!
www.youtube.com/watch?v=n58Gw3lsOMA&p=93F354112C492BDD
Cheers
In my eyes 20"" bmx - 26'' mtb - 29'' road bikes..
i'ts my right to post a comment on this subject and what i'm trying to say is when you ride 29" you're just like a truck running over the trails instead of riding them with skills..
29" INCHES OF SHIT that's what i call it tall ass mofos...
f*ck u and goodbye!
Some bmx riders are gonna hate on 26", and 26" riders are gonna hate on the 29" riders regardlessly
There's pros and cons to any wheel size. Innovation just makes the sandbox smaller.
Better equipment and technology just lessens the challenge of a trail, forcing one to build more challenging trails.
I believe you said something similar in one of your articles Richard, regarding trail riding on your SS Redline on trails you typically would ride your 5" bike on; if memory serves correctly, which would be a surprise. (article was from 05/06 I believe)
Personal anecdote. When I researched a bike for BC and the kind of trails here, I debated for a long time about whether to choose a 4" travel 29er or a longer travel 26er - which bike would provide more fun, comfort and performance? I ultimately decided on a 26" bike with 5/6" travel. The logic has to do with geometry changes for a 29er with more than 4" of travel combined with the handling/fun factor. I guess if I had to have only one bike to do everything, I might be inclined to go for a 4" travel 29er and live with it. Then again, I'm not a super aggressive, big air, hyper speed downhiller. Personal tastes, where you ride and skill level are probably the best criteria to decide which bike is best for you.
Origin of that crap lies in Specializeds doctrine statement which is pretty much common for all others: "Innovate or die". It is simply a result of typical capitalistic and neoliberal principles of 1. We need to be the best 2.We need to grow 3.To grow we constantly need new stuff". All world works like that nobody even thinks to question it. Lots of uncritical self confidence with lack of following discussion 1.What good does it do to be the best, best in what? 2.why to grow, when is it enough, 3 And does new stuff actualy help, and if so, helps in what and whom? Ultimately: why one must die from staying where he is and with what he has, and what do they mean by innovation.