Dissapointed with Rockshox ZEB

PB Forum :: All Mountain, Enduro & Cross-Country
Dissapointed with Rockshox ZEB
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flag Ploutre
Posted: Mar 30, 2022 at 11:15 Quote
The air side is identical between the different Zebs.

On the damper side, the Ultimate and Select+ have a "real" Charger damper (with high/low speed circuits), while the Select has a MotionControl-in-a-box "charger" damper. And the R has nothing, just a rebound piston. That could explain the difference in shaft diameter you've noticed ? Unless there was an error in the seals you had in the service kit, but that's unlikely.

But on the air side, from the Zeb R to the Ultimate, it's the same. There was at least 2 versions of the piston (a grey baseplate at first, then replaced by a red baseplate), and should soon be another one with the 2022 version, but the shaft is the same on all versions.
flag Vbar
Posted: Mar 30, 2022 at 23:16 Quote
Ploutre wrote:
The air side is identical between the different Zebs.

On the damper side, the Ultimate and Select+ have a "real" Charger damper (with high/low speed circuits), while the Select has a MotionControl-in-a-box "charger" damper. And the R has nothing, just a rebound piston. That could explain the difference in shaft diameter you've noticed ? Unless there was an error in the seals you had in the service kit, but that's unlikely.

But on the air side, from the Zeb R to the Ultimate, it's the same. There was at least 2 versions of the piston (a grey baseplate at first, then replaced by a red baseplate), and should soon be another one with the 2022 version, but the shaft is the same on all versions.

Thanks man for replying.
Are you sure about it?

It then makes no sense why the silver sealhead of the Zeb ultimate doesn't fit the airshaft of the Zeb Charger R. (Just to clarify, The sealhead internal hole that the shaft is going threw is much much thicker than the air shaft's outside diameter so it doesn't fit.

Isn't it possible the airshaft upgrade for the Zeb charger R to have a thicker airshaft?
I am asking this because my Zeb Charger R fork according to trailhead has an available upgrade for the airshaft.

So it would make sense such an upgrade because a thicker airshaft would increase the negative air volume of the fork thus the small sensitivity of the fork. So i consider it possible.

But if you are sure about your comments, then something else must be going on, but i cant figure it out yet.
flag Ploutre
Posted: Mar 31, 2022 at 0:11 Quote
Can you post pictures of the parts that don't fit ? I never bought a service kit for a Zeb as I kept sending mine out for warrantly for them to exchange the CSU every time, and then got fed up and sold it. So I'm not sure what they include in the service kit.

But I've disassembled mine quite a few times to change the air side piston, to increase the negative air chamber, and the piston I was using was the same for all the versions of Zeb (on paper anyway)
flag Vbar
Posted: Apr 4, 2022 at 0:31 Quote
Ploutre wrote:
Can you post pictures of the parts that don't fit ? I never bought a service kit for a Zeb as I kept sending mine out for warrantly for them to exchange the CSU every time, and then got fed up and sold it. So I'm not sure what they include in the service kit.

But I've disassembled mine quite a few times to change the air side piston, to increase the negative air chamber, and the piston I was using was the same for all the versions of Zeb (on paper anyway)

Hi there,

thats the kit i bought:

https://www.ridewill.it/p/en/rock-shox-x004318025188-service-kit-200-hours-1-year-for-zeb-select-ultimate-a1-dual-position-air-2021/1407690/

Keep in mind that my zeb is not the ultimate. Its the Zeb Charger R (the basic one)

So the part that could not fit was this:


https://ibb.co/0Dbv8zP

The shaft should be much thicker in order to fit correctly.
So my shaft is way το thin for this piston. this piston is designed for a much thicker saft.

So if you consider:
1. in the Zeb the air shaft is a huge part of the negative chamber (the airshaft itself is the negative chamber)
2. since this piston was designed for thicker shafts,

then i though that maybe there is an upgrade on the shaft that increases the negative chamber and the small bump sensitivity.

What is the CSU?
And how you tried to increase the negative chamber?
flag Ploutre
Posted: Apr 4, 2022 at 0:58 Quote
Aaaah but you may have bought the Dual Position service kit, while your Zeb is a Debonair one ?

Example for the 2 different kits on bike-discount :
Dual position
https://www.bike-discount.de/en/rockshox-zeb-r/select-a1-dual-position-service-kit-200h/1-year

Debonair
https://www.bike-discount.de/en/rockshox-zeb-select/ultimate-a1-debonair-service-kit-200h/1-year

And the Dual Position one has a much thicker air shaft. Not much you can do now, other than buy the right service kit, or just leave the baseplate if you didn't have any leaks from there.


CSU = crown steerer unit (stanchions, crown and steerer)

And I used a piston kit from Novyparts, that replaces the baseplate + red cylinder, and increases the negative air chamber. Slightly better sensitivity, more support in the mid travel, and stronger ramping up at the end of the travel.
flag Vbar
Posted: Apr 4, 2022 at 4:17 Quote
Ploutre wrote:
Aaaah but you may have bought the Dual Position service kit, while your Zeb is a Debonair one ?

Example for the 2 different kits on bike-discount :
Dual position
https://www.bike-discount.de/en/rockshox-zeb-r/select-a1-dual-position-service-kit-200h/1-year

Debonair
https://www.bike-discount.de/en/rockshox-zeb-select/ultimate-a1-debonair-service-kit-200h/1-year

And the Dual Position one has a much thicker air shaft. Not much you can do now, other than buy the right service kit, or just leave the baseplate if you didn't have any leaks from there.


CSU = crown steerer unit (stanchions, crown and steerer)

And I used a piston kit from Novyparts, that replaces the baseplate + red cylinder, and increases the negative air chamber. Slightly better sensitivity, more support in the mid travel, and stronger ramping up at the end of the travel.


Hey man!!! Thanks! yes you are correct!.
Life saver..lololo i was searching for this info but i couldnt find it!

OK so why the dual position has thicker air shaft?
Any idea?
Which one is better? debonair or dual position?


Thanks man
flag Ploutre
Posted: Apr 4, 2022 at 4:26 Quote
It looks like it's for the "upper air spring shaft" to slide into the lower air spring shaft. Here's an exploded view from a Yari dual position :
photo

Compared to a debonair yari :
photo


As for which is better, if you don't need the 2 position setup, a regular debonair is superior.
flag Vbar
Posted: Apr 4, 2022 at 5:13 Quote
Ploutre wrote:
It looks like it's for the "upper air spring shaft" to slide into the lower air spring shaft. Here's an exploded view from a Yari dual position :
photo

Compared to a debonair yari :
photo


As for which is better, if you don't need the 2 position setup, a regular debonair is superior.

lololol you are the man!

which of these systems is better?
flag jaame
Posted: Apr 4, 2022 at 11:04 Quote
Dual position air gives you two travel settings 30mm different.
I had a Totem DPA and it was shite in the short setting. The suspension feel was terrible. To be fair, the long travel wasn't great. I bottomed the fork twice in the entire time I owned it. I couldn't even bottom it with no air in it by riding around and bouncing the front wheel.
I couldn't imagine DPA being any worse.
flag Danzzz88
Posted: Apr 4, 2022 at 14:11 Quote
Dual position gives more travel adjustment or rather 2 travel settings but the suspension performance and stiction is worse than the standard air spring...hence why the more expensive ultimate doesn't have a dual position option. Either way the air springs suck in general...a Vorsprung Smashpot coil conversion will noticeably make the fork feel a lot, lot better.
flag DHhack
Posted: Apr 4, 2022 at 17:22 Quote
Danzzz88 wrote:
Dual position gives more travel adjustment or rather 2 travel settings but the suspension performance and stiction is worse than the standard air spring...hence why the more expensive ultimate doesn't have a dual position option. Either way the air springs suck in general...a Vorsprung Smashpot coil conversion will noticeably make the fork feel a lot, lot better.

Stiction on my Zeb Ultimate is absolutely unreal. Waiting for Vorsprung to ship out my smashpot right now.
flag Vbar
Posted: Apr 5, 2022 at 3:46 Quote
DHhack wrote:
Danzzz88 wrote:
Dual position gives more travel adjustment or rather 2 travel settings but the suspension performance and stiction is worse than the standard air spring...hence why the more expensive ultimate doesn't have a dual position option. Either way the air springs suck in general...a Vorsprung Smashpot coil conversion will noticeably make the fork feel a lot, lot better.

Stiction on my Zeb Ultimate is absolutely unreal. Waiting for Vorsprung to ship out my smashpot right now.

Since many people have this issue have you seen this?:

https://youtu.be/IbsMFIasfs0?t=255

This video and the other one with the air shaft trick solved all of my issues.

 


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