Products and People - Sea Otter 2013

Apr 25, 2013
by Mike Kazimer  
Although the booths have been taken down, and the caravan of bicycle industry vans and tractor trailers drove away from the Laguna Seca Raceway days ago, there are still a few more items from Sea Otter that are worth highlighting.



ONE Industries Autograph Signing With GT Factory Racing

photo

Members of GT Factory Racing, Rachel and Gee Atherton, along with Marc Beaumont, were on hand at the ONE industries booth to sign autographs for their fans. Rachel placed second in the dual slalom, and Gee pulled down a 12th in the downhill, but there's no doubt GT Factory Racing is looking forward to the longer, rowdier tracks on the World Cup circuit.

www.oneindustries.com



Manitou Marvel and Minute

Manitou Marvel and Minute

Manitou's Marvel (left) and Minute (right) suspension forks.


Manitou had their Marvel and Minute suspension forks on display, which are both now available for 27.5" and 29" wheeled bikes. The Marvel is an XC-oriented air-sprung fork with 80-120mm of travel. The fork uses Manitou's ABS+ damping system, and has eternally adjustable compression and rebound. Claimed weight is 1583g for the 27.5" version and 1683g for the 29er. The Minute fork, intended for trail riding, also uses the ABS+ damping system to control its 120-140mm of travel, but with a different shim stack for better handling on rougher terrain. Claimed weight is 1740g for the 27.5" version, and 1800g for the 29er. Both forks are available with 9mm open dropouts or Manitou's HexLock 15mm thru-axle, and should be available later this summer.

www.manitoumtb.com



Smith Optics Goggles

Smith Optics

Smith had their moto and mountain bike goggles on display, and hosted an autograph signing session of their own with Aaron Gwin spending some time in the booth. The goggles on display ranged in price from $40-$60 and were available in a wide range of colors and lens tints for all conditions. No word yet about any plans for a dirt-oriented version of their ski/snowboard I/O Recon goggle, but it seems like a goggle that can calculate speed and jump analytics would be a tech-savvy rider's dream...

www.smithoptics.com



Chris Chance - Mountain Bike Legend

Mountain bike history. Chris Chance with two of his creations.

Anyone familiar with the mountain bike scene in the late 1980s and early '90s will recognize the name Chris Chance. Chris started Fat City Cycles in Massachusetts in 1982, and quickly built a reputation for his handmade bike with their East Coast specific geometry. The company closed in 1994, and Chris now works as a practitioner of Shiatsu massage, but there is still a cult following for the early Fat Chance bikes. Chris was walking amongst the booths at Sea Otter with a few friends, each of them riding a piece of mountain bike history.



Chris Sugai's Take on Tweeners
Views: 13,835    Faves: 6    Comments: 36
Chris Sugai, Niner Bikes' president isn't afraid to express his views about the 27.5" wheel size. A passionate proponent of the 29er, Chris doesn't hold back in this brief clip about the future of the 'tweener in mountain biking.

www.ninerbikes.com




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Member since Feb 1, 2009
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97 Comments
  • 83 7
 Anyone else notice the amputee walk past between 13 and 16 seconds of the clip with the matching prosthetic legs (below the knee) ? Screw interviewing the guy from the company watching his sales crumble who HAS to tell you how the tweener size is just a short trend or something... interview THAT guy with the legs. I wanna hear his life story and how he came to be at sea otter.
  • 20 9
 Maybe he hasn't been told yet but 29" is that short trend that will disappear.... haha. He comes across as a very narrow minded individual in all the videos and written interviews he's been in.
  • 21 3
 I wouldn't put a cent in his pocket...back to the guy with the legs
  • 23 4
 I suddenly have even more desire to sell my 29er
  • 37 2
 Come over to the tweener dark side... we have cookies.
  • 6 2
 I've never liked the niner bike company since that interview on pinkbike a while ago when the company rep basically talked a load of bias crap.
  • 5 6
 Hah ya, clearly just scrambling to defend what he has invested so heavily in. He is so far off base it is absurd. For starters, I bet he knows damn well that 27.5/650b wheels are NOT directly in between 26" and 29". Man, considering the huge selection of great quality bikes these days that's plenty reason to never buy a Niner for the rest of my life. And I buy a new bike every season, so this video just lost that chump some potential money.
  • 4 1
 If the cookies are Walnut Chocolate Chip, count me in. I'm a fan of cookies.
  • 10 1
 I think it pays to be narrow minded. He's got a company called "niner bike" he's not gonna start making 650b bike is he with a name like niner.? So I'm sure he's treating to push 29ers as hard as he can.!!!!
  • 16 1
 I think you're confusing being "narrow minded" with the goal of convincing the public that your product is best, it's sales. I would argue against Sugai having a "narrow mind" he went off the beaten track of 26" rigs and founded a company that made a different option.
  • 7 4
 He just argued against himself. He pointed out disc brakes and rear suspension as technology that wasn't there in the beginning. They caught on and are definitly here to stay. He then said that the 27.5 is a new technology, but said that it's just a trend and isnt here to stay. wtf.jpg
  • 7 3
 But that's just very easy. It's not like people are going to buy fewer 29ers than before, it's going to grow. I work on bikes sale and today I can say that 29 movement is like half of all the MTBs we have sold since the beginning of this season. As long as the market would stay filled up with big wheel, it's going to increase. But this all is taken from the pool of 26 wheels, tweeners are not going to take any part of niners. We're about the next great improvement in MTB design - a wheel size that follows frame size, which seems to be reasonable. There are advantages of big wheel, but for now, as the idea is rather fresh, 650s are going to be treated by some as a short life fashion. I'm telling you, it's gonna be so different when the wheel size will no longer be attached to the riding style you prefer, but to your body size and proportions. This will be the moment when bicycle will be truly suited to a man. Mind my words in the future, please.
  • 4 0
 Sorry Chris 650b is going to take just as many sales from companies like Niner as it will from everyone else. I ride with a bunch of guys who bought 9ers then realized that where we live in Colorado they just don't work very well and most switched back to 26. Then there is the fact that Aaron Gwinn didn't run away with the win on a course that should have really favored the big wheels. Hundreds of a second isnt much. Wheel size obviously doesn't mean shit. It's got more to do with the rider than the wheels. But it seems Joe Cubicle has nothing better to do than send thousands of Emails to bike companies demanding another wheel size so that's what we are getting. Can't say as we really need another wheel size but, at least I won't have to buy a Niner
  • 5 0
 put your money where your mouth is and let's see the 29er dh bike.
  • 7 0
 I'm selling vacuum cleaner X and i'm telling you, vacuum cleaner X are the best in the whole universe...
  • 3 0
 He definately an expert on little tweeners
  • 2 0
 Nicely stated Look-out. I'm a 29er fan, but really want a burly 27.5 bike to add to the collection.
  • 7 6
 Chris Sugai is right up there with Chris Ellsworth for biggest douche-bags in the Mtn. Biking world ... What a f*cking blowhard. I'm betting he' got a computer full of kiddie porn.

Sorry Issac, but you can sell your product without trying to talk shit about every other product... His matter of fact way of talking about everything as if he's "figured it all out" is ridiculous. His bikes are niche at best and aside from looking kinda cool (ONE bike) they're simply made for the Banana Republic/Starfuct Crowd and priced accordingly. It's pretty clear he cares about one thing: making money, and that's fine, but he's not one to take seriously when you talk about progression/evolution of technology. I'd say the simple fact that the BEST brands on the planet are making 3 wheel sizes while his company beats it's head against the wall mumbling something about "7 minute abs"...
  • 3 0
 you just heard out loud the B.S. he has come up with to reasure himself that he didn't f'ck up and put all his eggs in one basket and not taking advantage of the different applications and advantages of different wheel sizes. hey chris i wouldn't start looking for a vacation home until this wheel size thing gets sorted out.
  • 5 0
 @ mnorris122

you.ve mis understood what he was saying, he was talking about cable actuated and the flex stem being tweeners. not suspension forks and hydraulic discs.

i reckon its an interesting point hes making to be fair.

clearly biased but thats his job
  • 1 0
 cable actuated discs that is
  • 9 0
 The correlation that the Niner president failed to notice was that for all the "tweener" advances he mentioned, they all were BEFORE people made the leap to new stuff. Suspension seat post were first then came rear suspension. Cable discs were first then came full hydraulic discs. etc etc etc. This analogy does not apply to wheel size as the 29er came out first THEN then 650b, not the other way around. People are not looking at 650B first, then make the leap to 29er...29ers are already here, so by his definition 29ers are the tweener technology.

Also I am like many MTBers and have different bikes for different riding styles but really looking for 1 bike that can ride everything, and do it well. 29ers are great for XC/trail, no doubt about that. And 26ers are good for DH/FR bike park type stuff. I think that a 150-160mm 27.5 bike(i.e. SC Bronson etc.) would actually be the first bike that would actually suit me for all the types of riding that I do....I dont think I could say that about a 29er.
  • 3 0
 Icculus you make a good point regarding the 29er being the real "tweener" here. 29ers have already been tested and proven as excelling in some situations, and the 27.5" is a refinement of that specific bigger wheel performance that lets them be more maneuverable. Since the "in-between" wheel size lets them perform on more varied terrain, I agree that if anything the 26" or the 29" will be the one to phase out, and the 27.5" will stay. It just needs to be embraced by the consumer - manufacturers have already embraced it.
  • 1 0
 So he seems to think mechanical brakes are gone? They may not be as good as hydraulics but I'm pretty damn sure they're still here...
  • 2 0
 Is legs man just wearing black high socks? He has a very comfortable looking gait.
  • 1 0
 anyone familiar with prosthetic limbs can tell... not to mention he's got blade-runner style carbon flex feet.
  • 23 0
 Sugai seems a little defensive, no?
  • 10 1
 Yeah totally. I mean I understand his desire to back 29ers, as his company makes them exclusively, but usually industry-types are not so defensive when it comes to something that their brand doesn't make. I suppose that the 27.5" craze is a direct competitor to the 29er in terms of accessibility.
  • 8 1
 i didnt watch it, but of course he'd be 'defensive' towards it.. 650b means big troubler for niner.
  • 29 1
 ... with that said. id much rather try a 650b over a 29'er..
  • 31 0
 Yeah they would have to change their name to "twentysevenpointfiver" ......is that going to fit on the downtube?
  • 5 1
 He also poo-poos on cable actuated disc brakes as being an in-between technology (fated to die out) from rim brakes to hydraulic disc brakes. I'd like to see what kind of market share cable/disc brakes have these days.
  • 10 2
 Cable-actuated disc brakes are a great alternative to spending hundreds of dollars on an expensive hydraulic system.
  • 5 1
 As a 26 owner I truly believe 650b is the next step for me. Not all sizes are meant for everyone, but once the price drops and more components are made I will make the switch. After riding a dual suspension 650b my mind is set.
  • 4 0
 What I think is funny is how he compares 29" wheels to the change from v brakes to hydraulic discs and from rigid forks to suspension. 29" is a good alternative but it is in a different category to everything he compared it to, I already read an article where he showed his narrow mindedness claiming that 29" is the only way to go in the future.
  • 8 4
 I think Chris Sugai makes an interesting point and that is certainly a different take on the wheel-size wars. It would have been easy for him to just downplay the benefits of the "tweener" size, but he looked at historical trends and formed a logical argument.

In conjunction with the fact that most companies that are really pushing 650b bikes hard...missed the boat on 29ers and are tying to make up lost market share...he might have a point.
  • 16 0
 It's Power Grips, not Power Straps. We still make those here in Grand Junction and plenty of people love them. We also make Tamer suspension seat posts. And we were the first to make 650b suspension forks (White Brothers). Our MRP AMg guide is kinda a "tweener" chainguide - half way between and XC guide and full-on DH guide. I guess we're the "tweener" technology company.
  • 9 1
 all i got out of his interview is that he doesn't like goldilocks and that somehow since she chose to show up she'll be eventually eaten or mauled by 2 other sized bears that were there first. there's issues there...
  • 9 2
 Goldilocks wasn't a bear.
  • 2 0
 He used these examples to try and show that 650b is a fad rather than admit that yes they do have a place alongside other wheel sizes. another thing is (I am a die hard 26er) 650b can still maintain long travel without ruining the bikes handling, I believe that long travel is hard to accomplish on 29ers, the big wheel size may make up for suspension over roots and rocks but a drop or jump landing is still the same so requires the travel offered on 26ers and 650b bikes
  • 3 4
 @EuanBisset145: Thank you for the recap professor.

You clearly missed the videos from Sea Otter this week showing 29ers & 650b(ers?) hitting quite sizable doubles and getting all kinds of steezy on the Sea Otter course.
  • 3 0
 c'mon, donch...i know she wasn't a bear.. she's metaphorically 650b inclined
  • 3 0
 ...and therefore will die cuz bears only 26 or 29 according to niner guy
  • 1 0
 this guy would represent 29ers....way to strike out on the trend examples.
  • 3 1
 @fullbug...I see a Tim Burtonish, dark version of the Goldilocks fairy tale in here somewhere. "Goldilocks Must Die" produced by Niner Bikes. Smile
  • 2 0
 Yes sea otter has jumps but most guys opted for short travel bikes on the smooth jumps. So lets change the location and say go somewhere that has real gnarly stuff then tell me the same, I can't remember the 29er at rampage, I wonder why......
  • 1 0
 Theoretically 650B wheels would be great on DH courses as they would be less likely to get stuck on rocks and ruts and more likely to just roll over obstacles. As long as you can make the bike handle as quickly and accurately as the 26" version then I think that 650B has a real future in DH.
  • 8 3
 try trusting hydros at -20º, or using rim brakes after ice has built up on the rim. Mechanical discs FTW in ice+snow.
  • 4 1
 Regarding cable disc brakes... i'm sure mr sugai was referring to the period when it was cable-actuated hydraulic calipers (Amp/Rockshox, Hope, Pro-Stop, Coda, etc) in the mid-90s when there wasn't even an industry wide mountain standard for the rotors or calipers. Discs tended to be specific to frame/fork models, and many brands took a route based on how car brakes worked as being easier to design around.

Take the Amp disc brake as an example as it was probably the most successful at hitting a wider (than ONE brand) audience, they worked with virtually any brake lever available at the time, and all you needed was a compatible frame/fork, a pair of hubs built into wheels, and the calipers and rotors. Since Amp sold their forks aftermarket, and for that matter supplied their seatstay assemblies to other frame builders for their rear suspension designs, and didn't patent any of the mount patterns (the caliper design itself was patented), Hell they even made disc flanges that bolted to shimano rear hubs, to convert a shimano hub to take discs (the amp flange bolted to the left hub flange thru the spoke holes, and you laced the left side spokes to the amp flange which then carried the braking loads). The design was so good that Rockshox bought it from Amp when they decided to get out of bicycles and focus on automotive/motorcycle industry work.

As to modern cable-discs and market share, the numbers are probably heavily slanted in their favour though that will likely end soon now that shimano makes hydraulic discs down to the Acera parts level. The majority of bikes sold new at stores are under a thousand dollars, and its hard to cram all sorts of features into that price point and still make a profit. Hence all the cable discs on new bikes. When shimano gets hydraulic to the Tourney parts level, the walmart store bikes will switch over also.
  • 2 1
 Yeah I think 650b has a future but I also think that 26" will always have it's place in wc dh.
  • 2 0
 On 2nd thought...I think what Sugai is saying is that he doesn't believe that all three wheels sizes will survive and in his opinion, 650b is going to die out. I would probably agree with him that all three won't survive, but not necessarily on which one will fade into the sunset. I also agree that 29ers are here to stay and will continue to eat up larger chunks of market share as people catch on.
  • 2 1
 Its going to be interesting to see what brands late to 29ers OTHER than specialized do. Kona and Rocky Mountain for example EACH designed one model 650B for 2013, and both have largely gone to 29ers for most of their XC Racing / XC Trail bikes and left the bigger AM/DH/FR stuff to 26ers (RMB has no 26er XC hardtails better than the Fusion for 2013). But Rocky has already sold out their entire production run of Altitudes which is an AM category bike and I'm betting Kona's run of Explosif AM hardtails is going fast also. Trek is a no-brainer to embrace it since Gary Fisher is who is largely credited with making 29ers popular, and Gary originally wanted to do 650B mountain bikes in the 1970s is still an important designer for them. Its just going to be a question of WHEN they announce, but my guess is around June when dealers are thinking forwards to Interbike (which is when GT will be officially letting the press see their ready for production new models).
  • 3 0
 Word is the early Trek price lists are FULL of 650b Bontrager tires...
  • 1 0
 @EuanBisset145: That's only b/c Enduro 29 wasn't available for this years rampage. Smile
  • 2 0
 Didn't if previously say that 26s were dying out and that 29 was the future? I think there will be three wheel sizes for a long time. Possibly for good.
  • 1 2
 Honestly his company is called niner, it's not like he's going to be touting a new competing wheel size any time soon. Give the guy a break he has a business he needs to keep afloat.
  • 4 0
 odo96 that's true, but he doesn't have to be such a jerk about it.
  • 7 1
 29ers have been here for the past 200 years, it's NOTHING new. My grandfather's bike is a 40 year old SSSR bike, works just fine, still has the SSSR tires on it, with a garden hose as grips and rust and oil as paint. 29er bikes are usually city bikes, they are not that nimble, but there are a dream for long trips. Just recently, did the brands start pushing them into the mountains. I'm not against it all, hell I LOVE bikes, I adore every single one of them, so if someone thinks 29 is better, so be it, but don't push it on the others. Some riders do require a 29 bike, look at CG, I think the 29 did help his recovery and he is not the only example, there are so many people with prosthetics, who need the bigger wheel.... Just buy a 26, if you like the 27.5, then go with that, if you liked how easy-going the 29 is, awesome. It's simple, we don't have to fight about it.
  • 1 0
 Amen!
  • 5 0
 Why is this still debatable? Why are people having such a hard time understanding that change is good? Riders have been progressively getting better and better and going bigger and bigger. Wouldn’t you expect that the bikes would change and adapt to new riding style and changing terrain?

It would seem to me, that mountain bikers of all people, would embrace change. After all, aren’t we supposed to the rebellious mavericks of the cycling world?

If you haven’t ridden a 27.5 wheeled bike, than I’m sorry, you simply don’t know what you’re talking about. Those of us that have know there is a real difference. Feel free to live in the past. I’ll be out on the trail riding the crap out my “tweener”.
  • 3 0
 Like all products, a new change in format is a complete re-sale bonanza. Bike companies, sold plenty of 26, sales were flat, now they want to sell, the 29, the 650b - make your 26 feel obsolete. Look at music companies, the album sold, then it was caseettes, now CD's, entire group catalogs keep getting re-issued and sold. Makes them richer. I predict, the 29er will be pretty much what it is - an Xc racer, low travel bike and the 650b will become what the All Mountain trail bikes are. It'll be awhile 'till the DH/FR crowd switch, but they too will have no choice but to go 650b by the bike companies push.
  • 7 0
 Sugai is such a douche. I thought he was the man for change. Ha! Clown
  • 1 0
 I think this is just great, the more options we have, the better. Specially for the people that can't use a 29er because of their height and want a bigger wheel. Also, each type of use (XC, AM, DH, etc.) will define what wheel size would be the best.

The only problem I see is that the Bike Shops will have some or a lot of trouble to have every single kind of fork, tyre, and wheel for every different size...
  • 1 0
 trend or fad I like riding various bikes and interested in different styles of riding to gain wider experience so if that means different wheel size I’m ok with that. Reminds me when YETI stated they would never make a 29'r. Funny thing is if you have a loyal rider base who asks-pleads for you to make them a bike, well that’s not such a bad thing, whether you agree with them or not. It’s good that people are passionate about whichever side they decide to choose and I commend Chris for standing up for what he believes.
  • 6 0
 YO EDDY!
  • 3 0
 If Chris is so sure, now would seem the time for Niner to start building those world dominating DH 29'rs he's intimating are the future.
  • 2 1
 He makes a tough to argue against point. Consider how long 29ers had to exist before they got any real love. They took a while to catch on and then finally they really did it and now they will never go away because there are a lot of tall people or people who ride certain ways.
But the pattern he mentions ignores the technologies that never took over. What about the 1.5 steerer tube? Too big, lets go back to the tapered tweener.
How about those wild forks with the rear shock up front? A few were around for a while and they died.
Some people love gripshift, but most of use like using our opposable thumbs.
How about the 20mm and the 15mm axles? Are 15's a trend that will die? Many say yes.
29er isn't going away. It makes too much sense for a lot of people, but not all of us. 27.5 might not last, but I'd sure like to have a try at it. If it rides better I will stick with it. Seems like there are niches to fill and while the 26 has held the trail niche for a long time it might be slightly better served by 650b, but maybe not better enough. 29er isn't going to do it for me, and 26 is a blast, but is it all it could be?
One final question that might bring up some interesting points: Why do DJ bikes use 26 instead of 24? What is better about 26 that makes it the sweet spot? Seems like all that smooth dirt and those big tricks would be better served by smaller wheels.
If the different size isn't big enough to make a difference there than maybe 650b is all a placebo effect. . .
  • 2 1
 I give them 2 years at most until the release a a 650b bike aimed at smaller riders, as at some point wheel size specific to rider/frame size is going to be put in play. Maybe they just put the 'less than' sign in front of the Niner logo
  • 3 0
 That was a short rampage of a question that we didn't even hear being asked, try to open your mind a little. You are judging his judging, double negative.
  • 4 1
 God, I hate listening to 29er guys talk. They are just for beginners, old people, and a must have for XC guys just to stay competitive.
  • 1 0
 Think I've got no money so ill stick with my mk1 nomad. In ten years when I need a new bike they will have sorted this B S out. Then ill buy another nomad
  • 1 0
 I should start a company called "twenty-seven point-fiver" to ride the wave also! Sagai will probably sue me for copying his name
  • 1 0
 Someone needs to tell him to start '7.5er'. "Six minutes abs not five it's six!! 12 lil chipmunks twirling on a branch eating nuts and berries of my uncles ranch!"
  • 1 0
 This sugai guy doesn't actually ride mt bike, does he...? Coz he sound like he got issues.
Wot a crok of verbal __________ !!
  • 1 0
 Manitou seems to have a huge hole in their linup... where's the 150-170mm travel burly AM fork?
  • 1 0
 Manitou aye...
  • 1 0
 So he didnt really take a stand, but I guess we wont see a 27.5" frome from Niner anytime soon ;-)
  • 4 1
 No but we will from Specialized after they've given up raving about how good 29ers are, and trek and giant and now all the euro companies who've embraced it wholeheartedly, STEAL a lot of sales from Specialized. Let's face facts...the horst-link patent expired a couple days ago, there's a crapload of European brands about to launch into the USA who all have horst-link suspension designs, and the ones that do and have 650B models ready to go, are going to steal sales from the company that doesn't.
  • 1 1
 REALLY?! damnnnn son. glad to hear this.. that means now i will have more options for my 27.5 build when i start it later this year Wink
  • 1 0
 Care to elaborate on those European company's? Lap is the only one I can think of. I kinda expected to see some new bikes from some company's sporting the horst-link.
  • 1 0
 Not sure what brands are going to start distributing in North America, but some with horst link that come to mind are Cube, Nicolai, and Liteville.
  • 1 1
 RC is working on an article about it that should be going online soon but Lapierre has already announced they're coming to America with all their models, including the horst-linked ones. Nicolai will DEFINITELY want to come over with his bikes given how he actually was the inventor (he worked for Amp Research at the time, and Horst Leitner's name went on the patent application as the inventor as he took credit for all the work of his employees). Ghost will be another brand moving to America, given how well they've done in Canada already the past year. I'd expect they'd love to work with the USA equivalent to MEC (REI) to just be a one-stop solution to a dealer network.
  • 1 0
 They would be online only, as most local REI stores fail to carry mountain bikes worth spending money on, unless you intend to get gnarly on a fire road.
  • 1 0
 So I was being sarcastic in my comment above. This guy is horrible at assessing the market, comparing suspension seatposts as a 'tweener' to dropper posts is just totally off. 650b/27.5 requires re-tooling in 4 sects of the industry: frame building, Rims making, Tire molding, and fork building. That is quite a bit different than any of his lame component analogies. 27.5" is the direction not a stop gap/ Werd.
  • 1 0
 I can totally see where he's coming from. He's talking about the riders who don't like such a big change from 26" wheels to 29" wheels. Those riders are not going to try a 29er, but they will give a 27.5 a go. I have a friend firmly in that camp. Only time will tell if he's right and those who try the 27.5 will then go on to try a 29er and 27.5 will die out. I seriously doubt it.

That's his main argument and it makes total sense when you compare it to the tweener technologies. But as others have said, this is a size and not really technology.

I do believe that Niner is not innovating and got burned by the new Enduro 29er if it's as good as the reviews say it is (but it's all media based and they are bought by Specialized). A company with Niner as their name should lead the way, not be following.

If Niner came out with a low BB, 145mm+ bike with short chain stays in carbon, I'd definitely consider it. An RDO WFO XTR blah blah blah. They should also consider doing an internal gear transmission - something no serious bike company is doing.
  • 1 0
 Pinion gearbox available if Niner wants to innovate....
  • 1 0
 Yet no freeeride, scratch that, _enduro_ fork from Manitou. Why! Whyyyyyyyy!
  • 1 0
 The Minute and Marvel still available in 26"??
  • 2 0
 Yes - the launch of the 27.5" and 29" versions makes it so the forks will be available for all wheel sizes.
  • 1 0
 so short¡
  • 3 3
 Sea otter classic is Badass!
  • 1 0
 Beta vs. VHS????
  • 2 1
 Or Blu-Ray vs HD DVD.

Betamax was the better picture quality of the two and the tapes were physically smaller but they only had half the recording time of JVC's VHS tapes. A variation of Betamax called Betacam is still used in television production to this day, but the cameras are record-only and you need a separate VCR unit to play back (or a very large camera). Fine for TV crews with support teams and news vans, not so fun with consumers. VHS cameras could playback and review on the camera itself, and could play back to any tv with a simple cable hookup (effectively becoming the VCR unit). It was a one-stop solution.

That's probably what people like Chris Sugai are most afraid of, that their chosen size, the 29er, IS the better choice aside from various packaging limitations (big wheels + big travel = big frames that won't fit many consumers, or BIG prices for the ones it will) and that consumers will instead go to the one-stop solution presented, that of 650B.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betamax
  • 2 0
 PUT EM IN THE RING for a FIGHT TO THE DEATH
  • 1 0
 Sad story about blue ray vs hd dvd. HD dvd was better because it worked internationally and was comapatable with dvd so you could use your old movies too and was otherwise pretty much the same, but got killed off by marketing of blu ray and because blu ray had a big head start it won. If this goes down with 650b, that it dies because of marketing by 29er producers I will be sad.







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